E Holt Averaging less than 15 minutes in B1G games thus far
- Thread starter chaboom
- Start date
I like his role as a sub. He brings energy. If Hanner plays well and then
Holt plays well, then you have a mighty fine center. The thing about Hanner is there are times when he brings energy and is a very positive force. If he does this he should get the most minutes,and Holt can back him up.
Holt plays well, then you have a mighty fine center. The thing about Hanner is there are times when he brings energy and is a very positive force. If he does this he should get the most minutes,and Holt can back him up.
I see it, most of us here see it
Apparently the one who should see it still doesn't.
He's stubborn when it comes to changing up the line-up. Baffles the mind. I've never seen a coach so unwilling to start a new or different 5.
But we've seen it for a while now so really should not surprise anyone.
I feel your frustration. Holt is such a better all-around player who can score and who has a good basketball IQ. I like Hanner but Hanner is Hanner. Holt brings more to the table for sure.
Apparently the one who should see it still doesn't.
He's stubborn when it comes to changing up the line-up. Baffles the mind. I've never seen a coach so unwilling to start a new or different 5.
But we've seen it for a while now so really should not surprise anyone.
I feel your frustration. Holt is such a better all-around player who can score and who has a good basketball IQ. I like Hanner but Hanner is Hanner. Holt brings more to the table for sure.
For what it's worth, and speaking from old, old, experience, until you give up on the more veteran player, you start him, see what he's got that game, and then play the freshman as needed. If the freshman starts and falters, bringing in a player, known to be inconsistent, leaves little alternative if he doesn't show up. You only increase the pressure level on the freshman by starting him, especially one who didn't expect to be thrust into the spotlight so early in his college career, not at an IU.
As long as the current approach is successful, I would think twice before making any major changes. The last thing one wants to happen is to lose the positive that Perea has shown from time to time. Perea is used to bench time and I'm not sure it can be used as an emphasis making him a bench player once again. Perhaps a one-game experiment might not hurt, but pick the game carefully.
As long as the current approach is successful, I would think twice before making any major changes. The last thing one wants to happen is to lose the positive that Perea has shown from time to time. Perea is used to bench time and I'm not sure it can be used as an emphasis making him a bench player once again. Perhaps a one-game experiment might not hurt, but pick the game carefully.
And everybody gets a trophy. How about coaching to win?
That approach tends to make players take their time for granted. Crean has been too loyal to some guys when it just doesn't make any sense. It's part of the reason Watford spent half of his career at IU jogging around not playing D or rebounding. It's also part of the reason Luke F transferred.
Play your best guys.
That approach tends to make players take their time for granted. Crean has been too loyal to some guys when it just doesn't make any sense. It's part of the reason Watford spent half of his career at IU jogging around not playing D or rebounding. It's also part of the reason Luke F transferred.
Play your best guys.
Do your fingers hurt?
This is another one of those post topics that has taken on a life of its own and appears daily. (Others: Why don't Hanner and Holt play together? Why does Crean substitute for the hot player? Why can't IU close halfs well? Why can't IU play better defense? Etc., etc., ad nauseam.)
Given the challenges this team faces, whatever Crean is doing is usually working out by the end of games -- not always, but usually.
Pounding the same sand over and over has to hurt after a while.
This is another one of those post topics that has taken on a life of its own and appears daily. (Others: Why don't Hanner and Holt play together? Why does Crean substitute for the hot player? Why can't IU close halfs well? Why can't IU play better defense? Etc., etc., ad nauseam.)
Given the challenges this team faces, whatever Crean is doing is usually working out by the end of games -- not always, but usually.
Pounding the same sand over and over has to hurt after a while.
CTC brought him here so he probably saw it first but
It's not about starting him, it's about playing him and getting effective minutes out of him, when Hanner struggles from fouls or just not into the game. I think CTC likes what Emmitt brings off the bench and Hanners inconsistency makes the decision tougher. 2 minutes in you know whether he has it or not and holt can come in and play.
It's not about starting him, it's about playing him and getting effective minutes out of him, when Hanner struggles from fouls or just not into the game. I think CTC likes what Emmitt brings off the bench and Hanners inconsistency makes the decision tougher. 2 minutes in you know whether he has it or not and holt can come in and play.
Crean being cautious?
He brought Hartman in before Holt as the first sub for Hanner. I get the feeling Crean doesn't have enough trust in Holt, or just wants to bring him along slowly. Could Crean be protecting him from injury because he knows he will be critical down the stretch?
I would consider changing the starting lineup since Hanner has started the last 3 games with 2 quick fouls. Maybe we start him, but pull him out after the first foul.
The only thing we give up playing Holt over Hanner is that Hanner can play above the rim more easily. Holt seems to have good hands and knows where he needs to be to get the ball. I believe Holt's strengths make him a good addition for the team when he gets in the game.
He brought Hartman in before Holt as the first sub for Hanner. I get the feeling Crean doesn't have enough trust in Holt, or just wants to bring him along slowly. Could Crean be protecting him from injury because he knows he will be critical down the stretch?
I would consider changing the starting lineup since Hanner has started the last 3 games with 2 quick fouls. Maybe we start him, but pull him out after the first foul.
The only thing we give up playing Holt over Hanner is that Hanner can play above the rim more easily. Holt seems to have good hands and knows where he needs to be to get the ball. I believe Holt's strengths make him a good addition for the team when he gets in the game.
In a team concept....
a good coach doesn't pick and choose loyalties. There are different approaches for different players, however loyalty is not one of them, that is if that coach wants it to work both ways, his to the team and the team to him.
Watford gave it all he had, and at times, it wasn't enough.
I thought Luke F. would/will be a decent player wherever, however, and since entering conference play at Marquette, he has averaged 10 points, 2.7 rebounds, and four fouls committed per game. To his credit, he has gained about 30 lbs. since he first arrived at IU and is more physically prepared now than he was then. Luke appears to me to be more of a finesse player than that of being real physical. At 6'11, that may not bode well for him going forward and beyond the college level of the sport.
a good coach doesn't pick and choose loyalties. There are different approaches for different players, however loyalty is not one of them, that is if that coach wants it to work both ways, his to the team and the team to him.
Watford gave it all he had, and at times, it wasn't enough.
I thought Luke F. would/will be a decent player wherever, however, and since entering conference play at Marquette, he has averaged 10 points, 2.7 rebounds, and four fouls committed per game. To his credit, he has gained about 30 lbs. since he first arrived at IU and is more physically prepared now than he was then. Luke appears to me to be more of a finesse player than that of being real physical. At 6'11, that may not bode well for him going forward and beyond the college level of the sport.
Yeah guys, let's not start any new basketball threads...
...that dare question any of IU's coaching moves. That should be off limits, right? dws
...that dare question any of IU's coaching moves. That should be off limits, right? dws
Re: Yeah guys, let's not start any new basketball threads...
Basketball is like many things when it comes to fans. Some feel that watching or reading about the game is akin to coaching the game, in other-words second-guessing is par for the course. Speaking of par, golf works the same way in many respects. If you're a player, I'll bet you've had a bogie golfer give you advice on improving your game, and it's usually, but not always, due to the fact the bogie golfer may be the best in the group, although not very good.
I had the privilege of meeting Sam Snead before he passed and he was once asked, "Mr. Snead, what swing guru would you tend to use if you were a young golfer on today's PGA tour?" His answer was, "hell, I wouldn't use any of them, none of them can beat me."
I may be wrong, however I take for granted there is no one that frequents this site who has outcoached Tom Crean in an actual game. So, I'll kind of agree with Mr. Sam in regards to all of the advice to and for Tom Crean on this site when it comes to coaching the game of basketball.
There's just too many who take themselves, and their advice, a little too seriously when it involves the IU coach. I see nothing wrong with it until it leads to the name-calling and personal digs. There's really no reason to question IU basketball other than for the won/loss record while, at the same time, realizing there are people responsible for determining the success or lack of such within the program itself.
There are some who think a dissenter of their thoughts deserves an argument and I disagree with that concept.
Basketball is like many things when it comes to fans. Some feel that watching or reading about the game is akin to coaching the game, in other-words second-guessing is par for the course. Speaking of par, golf works the same way in many respects. If you're a player, I'll bet you've had a bogie golfer give you advice on improving your game, and it's usually, but not always, due to the fact the bogie golfer may be the best in the group, although not very good.
I had the privilege of meeting Sam Snead before he passed and he was once asked, "Mr. Snead, what swing guru would you tend to use if you were a young golfer on today's PGA tour?" His answer was, "hell, I wouldn't use any of them, none of them can beat me."
I may be wrong, however I take for granted there is no one that frequents this site who has outcoached Tom Crean in an actual game. So, I'll kind of agree with Mr. Sam in regards to all of the advice to and for Tom Crean on this site when it comes to coaching the game of basketball.
There's just too many who take themselves, and their advice, a little too seriously when it involves the IU coach. I see nothing wrong with it until it leads to the name-calling and personal digs. There's really no reason to question IU basketball other than for the won/loss record while, at the same time, realizing there are people responsible for determining the success or lack of such within the program itself.
There are some who think a dissenter of their thoughts deserves an argument and I disagree with that concept.
Bring him along slowly
I agree that Holt has played well, but you don't know whether you would get the same results with him as a starter. I think it is wise to continue to put him in positions where he can succeed. He does not need to be thrown to the wolves at this point. Is he a good player? YES. Is he Noah Vonleh or Cody Zeller at this point? NO. And neither is Hanner, but at least he has been competing with these guys for the past couple of years.
Also, we have no idea what is happening in practice. People are quick to give up on Hanner, but he has had some bright moments this season. In the last game, he got caught on a moving screen because RJ started his drive too early and then he got caught being hooked by Amir Williams on a rebound in the post. Two tough plays that ended his half and he never got into the game. Does that mean he is done? In the end, I think people expected more out of Hanner and less out of Holt, which is a big reason why people are infatuated with the idea of Emmitt moving up the depth chart. I am just thrilled that we have a solid backup in the post. And to be honest, Hartmann has done an admirable job in the post as well, but nobody talks about starting him over Hanner. Why?
Don't make a change just to mix it up. We don't know what Hanner would give off the bench. I like Holt's energy coming into the game, and I would stick with it that way for now. It could change later, but why rush it right now? Maybe later in the B1G schedule, Holt will get more minutes as he gains experience. But he is still a frosh, so we'll see how things progress.
I agree that Holt has played well, but you don't know whether you would get the same results with him as a starter. I think it is wise to continue to put him in positions where he can succeed. He does not need to be thrown to the wolves at this point. Is he a good player? YES. Is he Noah Vonleh or Cody Zeller at this point? NO. And neither is Hanner, but at least he has been competing with these guys for the past couple of years.
Also, we have no idea what is happening in practice. People are quick to give up on Hanner, but he has had some bright moments this season. In the last game, he got caught on a moving screen because RJ started his drive too early and then he got caught being hooked by Amir Williams on a rebound in the post. Two tough plays that ended his half and he never got into the game. Does that mean he is done? In the end, I think people expected more out of Hanner and less out of Holt, which is a big reason why people are infatuated with the idea of Emmitt moving up the depth chart. I am just thrilled that we have a solid backup in the post. And to be honest, Hartmann has done an admirable job in the post as well, but nobody talks about starting him over Hanner. Why?
Don't make a change just to mix it up. We don't know what Hanner would give off the bench. I like Holt's energy coming into the game, and I would stick with it that way for now. It could change later, but why rush it right now? Maybe later in the B1G schedule, Holt will get more minutes as he gains experience. But he is still a frosh, so we'll see how things progress.
Re: Does Your Head Hurt?
If so, then pull it out of the sand. For the 2nd year running, we're not ranked in the top 25 and right now appear to be on the outside of the NCAA tourney looking in. So in what way is what Crean's doing usually working out by the end of games?
If so, then pull it out of the sand. For the 2nd year running, we're not ranked in the top 25 and right now appear to be on the outside of the NCAA tourney looking in. So in what way is what Crean's doing usually working out by the end of games?
Why not let the season play out
then decide whether this team is on the outside of the tournament.
then decide whether this team is on the outside of the tournament.
Why not try to come up with some new topics
but some of you guys get on the same topic and just beat it into the ground so it makes it hard to enjoy coming to this board.
but some of you guys get on the same topic and just beat it into the ground so it makes it hard to enjoy coming to this board.
Why start a new thread every day
on the exact same topic because it gets old and there is only so many ways to discuss the same thing over and over again.
on the exact same topic because it gets old and there is only so many ways to discuss the same thing over and over again.
Sam Snead was following my father-in-law and me at Panther Woods
in Vero Beach Florida. I was really hoping to break 100.
Sam and his group came up when my father-in-law hit a wormburner.
Sam said...I guess you hit that one a little low.
Sam was a hoot.
He had one mantra that he kept repeating...keep your head down, stupid.
Just kept repeating it... cracked me up.
He was right, too.
This post was edited on 1/12 7:32 PM by IU? I'm Fine
in Vero Beach Florida. I was really hoping to break 100.
Sam and his group came up when my father-in-law hit a wormburner.
Sam said...I guess you hit that one a little low.
Sam was a hoot.
He had one mantra that he kept repeating...keep your head down, stupid.
Just kept repeating it... cracked me up.
He was right, too.
This post was edited on 1/12 7:32 PM by IU? I'm Fine
Re: Does Your Head Hurt?
Saying we are outside the tourney looking in at this point is waaaaaay more than a little premature.
Saying we are outside the tourney looking in at this point is waaaaaay more than a little premature.
I looked back 5 pages and found one other thread started about
EH's playing time. Maybe I missed one, maybe not.
You do know that you don't have to open or respond to ANY post you don't like, don't you?
As I asked, like what? What topics do you want to discuss?
The three or four of you that always respond with the "getting old", "beating a dead horse" and " let the season play out" responses get REAL old too.
Like I said, there are only so many topics that can be discussed about basketball.
EH's playing time. Maybe I missed one, maybe not.
You do know that you don't have to open or respond to ANY post you don't like, don't you?
As I asked, like what? What topics do you want to discuss?
The three or four of you that always respond with the "getting old", "beating a dead horse" and " let the season play out" responses get REAL old too.
Like I said, there are only so many topics that can be discussed about basketball.
I'm talking about this team.
Last year was a disappointment, but I'm talking about the 2014-15 team, which is fun to watch despite being frustrating at times.
So before you tell me to pull my head out of the sand, make sure to read the post for context.
And, thus far much of what Crean has done this year has worked. You can deny that if you want, but the evidence is in the record,
Last year was a disappointment, but I'm talking about the 2014-15 team, which is fun to watch despite being frustrating at times.
So before you tell me to pull my head out of the sand, make sure to read the post for context.
And, thus far much of what Crean has done this year has worked. You can deny that if you want, but the evidence is in the record,
Re: I looked back 5 pages and found one other thread started about
You are taking a subject line.... which was fine... but it was a pretense for the repetitive old crap
You are taking a subject line.... which was fine... but it was a pretense for the repetitive old crap
Re: So we should just close the board down until the end of the season?
Uh topic was fine... it was the statement about not being in the top 25... outside of the tourney... let the season play out before fretting about such things! Simple
Uh topic was fine... it was the statement about not being in the top 25... outside of the tourney... let the season play out before fretting about such things! Simple
I like Holt but I am not sure it really matters if he starts or comes off the bench.
As far as experience goes while HMP is a JR his playing time has been very limited prior to this year so their game experience is probably not as big as many might think.
I say stay with HMP as the starter but bring Holt in when HMP is ineffective or needs a breather.
As far as experience goes while HMP is a JR his playing time has been very limited prior to this year so their game experience is probably not as big as many might think.
I say stay with HMP as the starter but bring Holt in when HMP is ineffective or needs a breather.
Re: Sam Snead was following my father-in-law and me at Panther Woods
I had played one hole with Sam in a fundraiser where he played a par-three with all groups. A few years later, we ran into him at the Cascades at the Homestead. He lived somewhere in the immediate area and one day joined us for lunch between nines on one of the Cascade courses. This was at the time he was recovering from the serious wreck he had been in. He even introduced us to his dog companion, he lovingly called Mike.
I won't go into further detail, but to say the least, we had a great time, although it was too short, with a gentle man. He could be rather blunt, but seriously funny and honest.
I had played one hole with Sam in a fundraiser where he played a par-three with all groups. A few years later, we ran into him at the Cascades at the Homestead. He lived somewhere in the immediate area and one day joined us for lunch between nines on one of the Cascade courses. This was at the time he was recovering from the serious wreck he had been in. He even introduced us to his dog companion, he lovingly called Mike.
I won't go into further detail, but to say the least, we had a great time, although it was too short, with a gentle man. He could be rather blunt, but seriously funny and honest.
Re: So we should just close the board down until the end of the season?
Good
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Good
Posted from Rivals Mobile
I'm sorry.....
Just saw your post when looking back on old posts. His accident was in April, 1992 on his way to the Masters. Snead was injured, however not as badly as another in the accident who was paralyzed.. I think Snead was 80 or so when it happened.
Just saw your post when looking back on old posts. His accident was in April, 1992 on his way to the Masters. Snead was injured, however not as badly as another in the accident who was paralyzed.. I think Snead was 80 or so when it happened.
Of 58 projected brackets in the Bracket Matrix, IU is in 51 of them.
Average seed is in the 9-10 range, but some have IU as high as a 6. Way too early to state we appear to be on the outside looking in.
Another month or so, we can get a clearer indication. I don't expect we beat ILL tomorrow, but a loss probably won't knock us off too many of those brackets.
Average seed is in the 9-10 range, but some have IU as high as a 6. Way too early to state we appear to be on the outside looking in.
Another month or so, we can get a clearer indication. I don't expect we beat ILL tomorrow, but a loss probably won't knock us off too many of those brackets.
Similar threads
