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Haha
Btw, world wide Wes is back. He's been around this group a lot since Christmas. Crean went all in to save his own ass. Just wait until WWW lines up a bunch of East coast kids for Tommie next season and beyond. Zeke may be smoking the pole of the orange man, but all is not legit. It's a house of cards that's soon to crumble.
It's like you're inside my head. Please pin this. This is the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Let me get this straight, you people are upset at Tom Crean because IU basketball doesn't graduate doctors? That's a new one, but I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Can someone do some research and update me on how many PhDs Kansas, Duke and North Carolina churn out on an annual basis? That would be helpful in understanding where we stand against the benchmark.
Jesus christ.....what's wrong with striving to be a STUDENT-athlete school/program? Yeah those other blue bloods win.....but win with ATHLETE-students. IU used to win AND do it with well accomplished students. And don't give me the "it's never going to be that way again" and "kids are different these days" bullchit excuses. We've seen what happens when Crean brings in these immature and undisciplined raw athletic freaks into the program who can't set a simple pick or screen.....how many off court issues have we had in the last 3 years?? Now this group seems to have their chit together but what happens when WWW brings in his products? Think it'll get any better? Just like crossfire has said, Crean brought in WWW to save his a$$ but there's a bigger price to pay when you sign on that dotted line for the deal the devil just cut you. This school doesn't need another future self imposed ban just because an incompetent coach couldn't make it happen at a basketball rich university with all the talent he ever needed in his back yard without getting in bed with WWW and his cronies.
@Tony Warwick:
I think you are overdramatizing my post a bit. If you are one of those people that want to sell your fanboy soul for wins, I understand, just come out and say it. I'd rather be the team that doesn't sell out, but luckily for you, Indiana has already sold out. I'm just one of those people that thinks the integrity of a program is worth more than any one and done recruit. UK fans, who are reviled here on Peegs for the very reasons I list above (and in multiple other posts), they do not care about campus rapes (see the Tubby Smith era), they don't care that their players don't graduate, don't care about cheating on and on.
I do, and a pillar of IU basketball was doing things the right way. That integrity was far more important than the 3 titles Knight left us with. If you do not understand that, and you want to be like other programs that skirt the rules, fine. You have to understand there are a lot of IU fans that simply do not think the ends justify the means. That type of "Wall Street" mentality is what is killing athletics.
Tom Crean is a slimeball. It is that simple for me.
I think you are overdramatizing my post a bit. If you are one of those people that want to sell your fanboy soul for wins, I understand, just come out and say it. I'd rather be the team that doesn't sell out, but luckily for you, Indiana has already sold out. I'm just one of those people that thinks the integrity of a program is worth more than any one and done recruit. UK fans, who are reviled here on Peegs for the very reasons I list above (and in multiple other posts), they do not care about campus rapes (see the Tubby Smith era), they don't care that their players don't graduate, don't care about cheating on and on.
I do, and a pillar of IU basketball was doing things the right way. That integrity was far more important than the 3 titles Knight left us with. If you do not understand that, and you want to be like other programs that skirt the rules, fine. You have to understand there are a lot of IU fans that simply do not think the ends justify the means. That type of "Wall Street" mentality is what is killing athletics.
Tom Crean is a slimeball. It is that simple for me.
lol....right over your head.
THAT is what you got from that entire post? *facepalm*. Yea, I'd ignore the rest too if I were you.
Wow, I didn't realize the paranoia level around here was that high. Maybe you should go see one of the former players for medical advice.
No, I also read that ads in Assembly Hall are bad. Sounds like someone who has his priorities in check.
None of it is "over my head", it's all just pissing and moaning about getting old and longing for the good ole days. Get with the times or get out of the way.
Just stop. Good grief. You want to support and enable mediocrity with the occasional good season that ends in disappointment, fine. You want to condone the same gray areas that we, as IU fans, call out other fringe-riding programs on, fine. You're picking and choosing to ignore the large issues, both with this team, and with the program as a whole.
So just come out and say it. You love Crean. You love the way he conducts "business". You believe him to be worthy of 3 mil per and a 3/4 million dollar annual spend on recruiting.
@Tony Warwick:
So I make several posts listing the reasons the anti-Crean crowd doesn't like Crean. Here are a summary of your responses.
We are paranoid, sham degree programs are ok but belittling past IU bball graduates is ok because *gasp* they were student athletes, and my priorities are out of whack because Assembly Hall has become like every other crappy college arena in America.
If you want to debate, please do. If you don't want to debate, then simply move on to the next thread. You are kind of going Boiler Gal on us at the moment.
So I make several posts listing the reasons the anti-Crean crowd doesn't like Crean. Here are a summary of your responses.
We are paranoid, sham degree programs are ok but belittling past IU bball graduates is ok because *gasp* they were student athletes, and my priorities are out of whack because Assembly Hall has become like every other crappy college arena in America.
If you want to debate, please do. If you don't want to debate, then simply move on to the next thread. You are kind of going Boiler Gal on us at the moment.
Well if it didn't go over your head then your reply makes no sense.
You clearly didn't get the point, so either make a reply that makes sense to the OP.
I don't think you will because it went over your head, your history says this is the likely answer.
I get you are happy with IU under Crean and people like you will keep IU down. I prefer NTs, but you are happy with IU as it is. Different expectations is all.
Cutting corners and living in the gray areas ISN'T getting with the times. It's the wrong way of doing things. If that's now not just condoned, but celebrated at IU, then my fandom (and a lot of others) is over. This whole convo is sad and pathetic.
Enlighten me.
Let me ask, what program out there does it the right way? Every school mentioned here has done the same things you accuse Crean of doing and worse. I'm not saying it's right, but holding the program to some fictional standard is chitbox crazy. No coach will be able to make you happy, not Steve Alford, not Gregg Marshall, not Brad Stevens, no one.
Wait.
So IU is supposed to use those programs as a benchmark?
Damn right we should.
Great, grand.....lets just join all the other programs who make a mockery of the student athlete. Fk that line of thinking.
And fictional?? Jesus christ dude.....we did it for nearly 30 years under Knight.....we WERE that program!! We put the RIGHT people in the RIGHT places and we have an environment where we can be that again.....but that's not how everyone else does it, right? Let's be like Lance Armstrong and cheat because every else was......that's great for a few years but what does history say about those people/programs?
Everybody just wants the quick fix, the quick high anymore........what's so bad about working hard, building, striving for more.....this gawd dam world has become the movie Idiocracy hasn't it? Athletics, politics, obsessions with reality and NFL stars......fk me. Everyone is just lazy as fk.
@Tony Warwick:
The "everyone else does it, so why shouldn't we" argument is a UK fan argument. The point is Crean is rubbing elbows with WWW. After A-hope, and hiring Calipari's ex assistant, I kind of think the old saying "where there is smoke there is fire" is applicable here, thus my "paranoia." Given the events under Sampson, and the program getting the equivalent of the death penalty, a little paranoia is warranted.
I'll just respect your opinion and move on. I think Zeke made a good point about being positive earlier in the thread, but the line between positivity and putting blinders on is a thin one.
The "everyone else does it, so why shouldn't we" argument is a UK fan argument. The point is Crean is rubbing elbows with WWW. After A-hope, and hiring Calipari's ex assistant, I kind of think the old saying "where there is smoke there is fire" is applicable here, thus my "paranoia." Given the events under Sampson, and the program getting the equivalent of the death penalty, a little paranoia is warranted.
I'll just respect your opinion and move on. I think Zeke made a good point about being positive earlier in the thread, but the line between positivity and putting blinders on is a thin one.
To be clear, I'm not in favor of this approach, I was simply suggesting that most of the successful programs that everyone here strives to be like (MSU, North Carolina, Kansas) all have skeletons in their closet.
I saw a pic of WWW with Boo Williams and some other dude at Nick's, what's the background and why does everyone suddenly think that Crean is succeeding now because he is building a pipeline with WWW? If that happens, then I'll be just as pissed as you, but I have no reason to believe that is the case. Not to sound naive, but what east coast kids are we looking at that are linked to Wes? Is Maker? Again, this all sounds like Red Scare stuff to me, but perhaps I don't know all the facts.
Lol. My hero? RMK? Listen, shortbus. You and I aren't even on this board having this idiotic discussion about a mediocre coach, were it not for "my hero". This kind of stupid mindset that embraces lowered expectations and then overlooks the disappointment that STILL comes at the end of each and every season are part of the devaluing and descent of the program. I'm glad "my hobby" isn't being a sycophant for a $hitty, overpaid coach and the dumbing down of a once proud fanbase.
It started with Boo Williams and selling IU's soul to having Troy isolate out front and then fall down making spastic, out of control drives to the hoop 17 times per game. It's ok. I realize you're too dumb to connect the gigantic dots.
What lowered expectations? You don't like Crean, I get that. I'm not the biggest fan either, but perhaps OUR hero said it best. If something is inevitable, then perhaps we should all just sit back and enjoy it.
I would stop replying to people that are this stupid if I were you. You asked what program doesn't have skeletons in its closet. Actually, you asked the question, then reworded it again in another post. Yet, no1 had a answer for you. One moron said we WERE that program...... Yup back when there was no social media, our coach could strangle people, and tell the media to F Off. Times haven't changed or anything...... Crean has done a brilliant job with this team, and anyone that can't see that doesn't want to or is just a stubborn fool.
NAME ONE PROGRAM that does well that doesn't take on the troy williams of the world. Please one of you retards, name me a program. Don't call me names and change the subject, answer the Fing question. Name a program that does it the right way and succeeds? I will rip your answer to shreds I promise.
Butler. Gonzaga. Wisconsin. Xavier, under Chris Mack for sure.
There's a few. Feel free to rip me to shreds, Cavdog.
There's a few. Feel free to rip me to shreds, Cavdog.
Jesus.....the great gambler is back again.
STFU and go gamble the right way.....russian roulette.
Please forget to take 1 out of the chamber.
IIRC, during Kyrie's recruitment, it became known that Crean wouldn't agree to their terms. Kyrie ended up at Duke. You figure it out.
Troy isn't a perfect player, but he was benched and now he is playing a lot better. If you want to hate on him, have at it, but I prefer to "embrace mediocrity" and all of the fun that goes with it.
Those are IU's peers? Wow. How many championships between those schools?
Rip us to shreds? You mean like you do your girlfriend every night. And here is a nice pic of you two just prior to attending the last game. I see you were wearing your Tom Crean Replica Coaching shirt for the occasion.
Crean and "Brilliant Job" are a laughable pairing.
If you think Crean is "brilliant" you may be a tad deluded. Again, Crean has meet expectations at IU a grand total of 1.5 years out his 8 years here. Crean's 17 year career record backs up the assertion he is a mediocre coach.
Again, he is a dick with ears. He doesn't have the chops to coach at a school like IU. His salary is a waste of money.
If you think Crean is "brilliant" you may be a tad deluded. Again, Crean has meet expectations at IU a grand total of 1.5 years out his 8 years here. Crean's 17 year career record backs up the assertion he is a mediocre coach.
Again, he is a dick with ears. He doesn't have the chops to coach at a school like IU. His salary is a waste of money.
@Tony Warwick:
Thanks in part to Crean, those teams are not IU's peers, they have surpassed us.
Furthermore, IU has been to one final four since 1987. It is abundantly clear Crean is not the coach to hang another title banner at IU.
I named those schools because they have achieved far greater success than IU has under Crean....doing it without WWW and Boo Williams.
Thanks in part to Crean, those teams are not IU's peers, they have surpassed us.
Furthermore, IU has been to one final four since 1987. It is abundantly clear Crean is not the coach to hang another title banner at IU.
I named those schools because they have achieved far greater success than IU has under Crean....doing it without WWW and Boo Williams.
Lmao. Really? That's how that recruitment went down? It wouldn't be because Kyrie's dad asked the main recruiter, you know, former Dukie McCleod who he played for or would play for and got a non-response. Hmmmmmm, it was shortly after that that he was "no longer a part of the program". It couldn't be that an elite player wanted to play for a guy that coaches the Olympic team and is in the HoF. Noooooooo. They had to buy him. You may actually be dumber than I thought.
Well that was easy you just named 4 programs that have not one a championship Since 1941, the other 3 never have........... Real Blue Bloods you got there? So mediocracy is ok now?
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