Charges Issued In Breonna Taylor Case

mushroomgod_1

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We might be able to estimate, based upon historical data. But that's just an estimate and it's just looking backwards.

Does that help solve the systemic racism argument? I don't think so . . . it puts us right back where we are currently, which is everybody just advocating for their own perceptions of the issue.

In other words, at least with respect to use of deadly force, you're wrong and don't want to admit it.
 

INRanger27

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Yep, you have strong feelings of wanting to avoid dealing with the issue of institutional racism. I have data, and showed my work. :p
You’ve not presented a scintilla of data - but you have presented plenty of emotion and “I just know I’m right” - which is your prerogative. There is an abundance of data that should serve at the root of the “where do we go from here” question, but we all need to baseline ourselves first and an increasingly awful media is at the spear of preventing that. Now apparently we have a VP candidate fomenting it also.
 

Sope Creek

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"After researching the FBI numbers for "Suicide of a Superpower," this writer concluded: "An analysis of 'single offender victimization figures' from the FBI for 2007 finds blacks committed 433,934 crimes against whites, eight times the 55,685 whites committed against blacks. Interracial rape is almost exclusively black on white — with 14,000 assaults on white women by African Americans in 2007. Not one case of a white sexual assault on a black female was found in the FBI study.""
None of that supports mushroomgod's statistical assertions.

None of it supports Mas' assertions regarding Black-on-Black crime.

And none of it explains the why of Blacks committing violent crimes.

My reading of your post is that you want to conclude "white good, Black bad". Is that the import of your post?
 

mushroomgod_1

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No, The accurate post is that a Black Thug shot the hero police officers! He has also been arrested! So you’re the one that has the shit post, wanna to be!

The MSM is so disgusting..............

CNN' s report names the perp, Larynzo Johnson....no mention of race..............nothing even about the suspect from other MSM sources as of right now.

No questioning of the preliminary charges...........which were 2 counts of 1st degree assault, 14 counts of wanton endangerment......no attempted murder? WTF is that? So I can walk up and shoot a cop in the stomach and not be charged with attempted murder?
 

Sope Creek

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You’ve not presented a scintilla of data - but you have presented plenty of emotion and “I just know I’m right” - which is your prerogative. There is an abundance of data that should serve at the root of the “where do we go from here” question, but we all need to baseline ourselves first and an increasingly awful media is at the spear of preventing that. Now apparently we have a VP candidate fomenting it also.
And now you're off the rails . . . buh-bye.
 

Sope Creek

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The MSM is so disgusting..............

CNN' s report names the perp, Larynzo Johnson....no mention of race..............nothing even about it from other MSM sources as of right now.

No questioning of the preliminary charges...........which were 2 counts of 1st degree assault, 14 counts of wanton endangerment......no attempted murder? WTF is that? So I can walk up and shoot a cop in the stomach and not be charged with attempted murder?
Race went out as an identifying characteristic in news reports about 40 years ago.
 

INRanger27

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The MSM is so disgusting..............

CNN' s report names the perp, Larynzo Johnson....no mention of race..............nothing even about the suspect from other MSM sources as of right now.

No questioning of the preliminary charges...........which were 2 counts of 1st degree assault, 14 counts of wanton endangerment......no attempted murder? WTF is that? So I can walk up and shoot a cop in the stomach and not be charged with attempted murder?
Why would they report race? It’s not relevant.
 

INRanger27

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I see you're the engineer and conductor of that train. Enjoy the ride!
The sad part is that we fully agree this case was tragic and was bad policing that should be punished. We likely agree on that with all of these recent high profile police maimings and killings. Yet, I’d like to try to get to a baseline set of facts that very well may yield “systemic racism” when compounded with additional info and facts but you’re not willing to come to that table in good faith. Without understanding where the real problem(s) lie, we cannot possibly come to meaningful change. Why a sharp like you can’t get there saddens me. I’m sad.
 

Mas-sa-suta

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So you agree that the warrant issued was for a no-knock op?

In addition, do you think police transcripts are perfectly accurate and unbiased?
I have not read the warrant. Have you? Only Jesus is perfect.
Bias, like beauty, exists in the eye of the beholder. My bias leans against
crack, meth and fentanyl criminals.
Your bias seems to be against law enforcement
Sad.

 
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Lucy01

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The MSM is so disgusting..............

CNN' s report names the perp, Larynzo Johnson....no mention of race..............nothing even about the suspect from other MSM sources as of right now.

No questioning of the preliminary charges...........which were 2 counts of 1st degree assault, 14 counts of wanton endangerment......no attempted murder? WTF is that? So I can walk up and shoot a cop in the stomach and not be charged with attempted murder?
Saw a picture of Larynzo in the Louisville paper, he Black!
 

Sope Creek

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I have not read the warrant. Have you? Only Jesus is perfect.
Bias, like beauty, exists in the eye of the beholder. My bias leans against
crack, meth and femtanyl criminals.
You bias seems to be against law enforcement
Sad.

You know nothing about me.
 

StelioKontos

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Only Jesus is perfect

You said only Jesus when you meant to say only Jesus, covid-45 and schicklgruber. Why the lie by omission?
 

Sope Creek

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The sad part is that we fully agree this case was tragic and was bad policing that should be punished. We likely agree on that with all of these recent high profile police maimings and killings. Yet, I’d like to try to get to a baseline set of facts that very well may yield “systemic racism” when compounded with additional info and facts but you’re not willing to come to that table in good faith. Without understanding where the real problem(s) lie, we cannot possibly come to meaningful change. Why a sharp like you can’t get there saddens me. I’m sad.
Thank you for the kind words . . . I'm sad that you're sad. 😟

If it helps, I think we're having two different conversations and you've ended up accusing me of all sorts of bad things because of that . . . like your accusation that I'm "not willing to come to the table in good faith". You can stick that one where the sun don't shine, Ranger.

Where our separate conversations might intersect is that I'm looking to follow the data to get to where the root of any systemic racism might be, and it seems like you're wanting me to produce a baseline set of facts for determining whether they yield a basis for finding whether systemic racism does or does not exist. I don't have that data. If I did I'd be running a think tank or running for national office or something.

All I've ever been saying is that the discrepancies in the surface data - the 23.4%/13.4% - merit additional investigation and that there may - might - be "business necessity" type of data that shows the discrepancies have a reason behind them. If you go back and look at the record of my conversation with mac - into which you inserted yourself - I was the one who first introduced the notion that the higher rate of police killings of Blacks might be explainable by a higher incidence of Blacks committing violent crimes. I'm just not impressed with your use of arrests as a proxy for crimes to validate such a conclusion . . . I think that the issue at hand is more important than that. Further, if we are able to validate that conclusion then digging deeper into the why of Blacks committing more violent crimes would be the next logical step to me. Some - like dbm apparently - would stop there and say that those statistics "prove" that there's something inherent about Blacks that results in higher violent crimes. I just think that those data points would be the basis for the next inquiry . . . and once we've explained all of the discrepancies with statistically meaningful data as support we'll be closer to what you call a "baseline set of facts" . . .

. . . I do have to say, though, that the US' history of slavery and Jim Crow provide a pretty darned compelling surface explanation for any disparities in rates of crime. I do believe that the type of statistical analysis I'm hoping will occur will point to the US' original sin as at least a significant part of the reason for those discrepancies. But I'm open to being surprised. It wouldn't be the first time I've been surprised by actual data.

In sum, I don't have any answers to these questions . . . I have a lot of legitimate and good faith questions that I am firmly convinced, when answered objectively, could help get us closer to your baseline set of facts. But I find too few interested in a legitimate, objective and good faith inquiry/analysis in that direction. I'm gonna guess that mac would welcome the inquiry . . . but might not be comfortable with the results. I'm not sure where you would come out . . . you seem to say you're interested in such an inquiry, but you also seem to have anticipated the results even more than I have. (I know, stick that one . . . .)

So tell me . . . what is it you want, and of that what part do you want from me?
 
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mcmurtry66

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The sad part is that we fully agree this case was tragic and was bad policing that should be punished. We likely agree on that with all of these recent high profile police maimings and killings. Yet, I’d like to try to get to a baseline set of facts that very well may yield “systemic racism” when compounded with additional info and facts but you’re not willing to come to that table in good faith. Without understanding where the real problem(s) lie, we cannot possibly come to meaningful change. Why a sharp like you can’t get there saddens me. I’m sad.
Thank you for the kind words . . . I'm sad that you're sad. 😟

If it helps, I think we're having two different conversations and you've ended up accusing me of all sorts of bad things because of that . . . like your accusation that I'm "not willing to come to the table in good faith". You can stick that one where the sun don't shine, Ranger.

Where our separate conversations might intersect is that I'm looking to follow the data to get to where the root of any systemic racism might be, and it seems like you're wanting me to produce a baseline set of facts for determining whether they yield a basis for finding whether systemic racism does or does not exist. I don't have that data. If I did I'd be running a think tank or running for national office or something.

All I've ever been saying is that the discrepancies in the surface data - the 23.4%/13.4% - merit additional investigation and that there may - might - be "business necessity" type of data that shows the discrepancies have a reason behind them. If you go back and look at the record of my conversation with mac - into which you inserted yourself - I was the one who first introduced the notion that the higher rate of police killings of Blacks might be explainable by a higher incidence of Blacks committing violent crimes. I'm just not impressed with your use of arrests as a proxy for crimes to validate such a conclusion . . . I think that the issue at hand is more important than that. Further, if we are able to validate that conclusion then digging deeper into the why of Blacks committing more violent crimes would be the next logical step to me. Some - like dbm apparently - would stop there and say that those statistics "prove" that there's something inherent about Blacks that results in higher violent crimes. I just think that those data points would be the basis for the next inquiry . . . and once we've explained all of the discrepancies with statistically meaningful data as support we'll be closer to what you call a "baseline set of facts" . . .

. . . I do have to say, though, that the US' history of slavery and Jim Crow provide a pretty darned compelling surface explanation for any disparities in rates of crime. I do believe that the type of statistical analysis I'm hoping will occur will point to the US' original sin as at least a significant part of the reason for those discrepancies. But I'm open to being surprised. It wouldn't be the first time I've been surprised by actual data.

In sum, I don't have any answers to these questions . . . I have a lot of legitimate and good faith questions that I am firmly convinced, when answered objectively, could help get us closer to your baseline set of facts. But I find too few interested in a legitimate, objective and good faith inquiry/analysis in that direction. I'm gonna guess that mac would welcome the inquiry . . . but might not be comfortable with the results. I'm not sure where you would come out . . . you seem to say you're interested in such an inquiry, but you also seem to have anticipated the results even more than I have. (I know, stick that one . . . .)

So tell me . . . what is it you want, and of that what part do you want from me?
i'm always interested and welcoming of results. although not to sound like too big of an ahole my mind's pretty set. with the numbers of 1004 to 235 and the rate of violent crimes being what they are i see little point in discussing whether systemic racism exists in these cop killing cases. as to the 60 percent robberies and 53 percent homicides i think this is a far more salient topic yet i think we all already know the underlying causes: education (as COH rightfully belabors the hell out of); broken homes; lack of opportunity; lack of training; credit racism; loan racism; general racism; addiction treatment; mental health treatment; third shift daycare; alternative sentencing; drug charge reforms; 400 years of oppression and segregation; lack of generational wealth creation and transfer; the list goes on and on. while i believe these underlying causes are what we ought be discussing and addressing we as a country are instead discussing cop killings (of which are unlawful one could probably count on one hand) and defunding the police.
 
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TheOriginalHappyGoat

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I think it also has to do with where people live along ethnic lines and density. Urban areas have a ton of police per citizen compared to more rural areas. It’s quite possible that AAs are “over-policed” compared to whites and Hispanics at the national scale, but to call that racism takes proof and it is very well explained by there being a lot more police in cities.
This is exactly what I was talking about regarding arrest rates. Racial disparities in terms of where people live and how those areas are policed can skew the numbers. They can also skew the numbers as to actual crime, as well, though, since urban areas are always more likely to give rise to crime.

Long story short, trying to explain all this with simple algebra is probably a fool's task.
 

INRanger27

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This is exactly what I was talking about regarding arrest rates. Racial disparities in terms of where people live and how those areas are policed can skew the numbers. They can also skew the numbers as to actual crime, as well, though, since urban areas are always more likely to give rise to crime.

Long story short, trying to explain all this with simple algebra is probably a fool's task.
Trying to look at real numbers a few layers beneath the onion peel is at least an honest attempt to try to figure out root cause and identify problems that can have actionable solutions. Doing nothing other than playing the race card certainly isn’t. Just saying “I know that’s what it is” certainly isn’t.

Urban areas have more people and need more police. To under-police has deleterious effects as we’ve previously discussed. Having more people in a city and those people primarily being AA in most cities and having more arrests for violent crimes in those cities is not evidence of racism.
 

T.M.P.

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Trying to look at real numbers a few layers beneath the onion peel is at least an honest attempt to try to figure out root cause and identify problems that can have actionable solutions.
You could go through the layers of 1,000 onions and still not have the correct information. It's a human condition that's beyond the capacity of laws to fix. It has to become cultural norm to treat people of color the same as one not of color. To give the same benefit and level of scrutiny, to be as accepted and as valued. That is not the current dynamic and that is the root.

Every reason pre-listed in this thread like economic and education are part of the problem and the fix but not the root. Is there systemic racism. Yes, we're born with it, every freakin person in every society. Then society conditions and molds some to overcome, while others fall prey to the ignorance and fear.

We are tribal, we herd together for protection and our survival instinct is to distrust others outside our herd. Like any herd animal, it's instinct. It begins there and expands into 10000 different reasons. Fear outsiders. It just another animal instinct we need to overcome. It can not be fully eliminated by law or rule if the social dynamic and the way people are treated doesn't change.

Do you ever wonder when a white kid is killed by police, if he was only killed because he was white? Of course not. Do you want to know why many blacks do? Because of the way they are treated by society and by police. Not every black person has a bad experience with cops but too many have.

Instead of looking at numbers which will get nowhere but further argument. Teach the children, well. Through generations it will eventually change. In the meantime keep questioning it. Keep talking about and make it one of the conversations we as a society need to have. Treat people well and when you see others being racist, call them out.
 
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mcmurtry66

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You could go through the layers of 1,000 onions and still not have the correct information. It's a human condition that's beyond the capacity of laws to fix. It has to become cultural norm to treat people of color the same as one not of color. To give the same benefit and level of scrutiny, to be as accepted and as valued. That is not the current dynamic and that is the root.

Every reason pre-listed in this thread like economic and education are part of the problem and the fix but not the root. Is there systemic racism. Yes, we're born with it, every freakin person in every society. Then society conditions and molds some to overcome, while others fall prey to the ignorance and fear.

We are tribal, we herd together for protection and our survival instinct is to distrust others outside our herd. Like any herd animal, it's instinct. It begins there and expands into 10000 different reasons. Fear outsiders. It just another animal instinct we need to overcome. It can not be fully eliminated by law or rule if the social dynamic and the way people are treated doesn't change.

Do you ever wonder when a white kid is killed by police, if he was only killed because he was white? Of course not. Do you want to know why many blacks do? Because of the way they are treated by society and by police. Not every black person has a bad experience with cops but too many have.

Instead of looking at numbers which will get nowhere but further argument. Teach the children, well. Through generations it will eventually change. In the meantime keep questioning it. Keep talking about and make it one of the conversations we as a society need to have. Treat people well and when you see others being racist, call them out.
With the way kids are today racism has only a few decades left - at most. Really good post.
 

MyTeamIsOnTheFloor

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Lawyer, former Louisville NAACP president says grand jury correct not to indict 2 officers in Breonna Taylor case

https://www.wdrb.com/news/lawyer-fo...cle_bcb5c4dc-feab-11ea-9813-73f9355c1765.html

I see Aubrey Williams every time I’m in our courthouse

While I see he claims that the AG “rushed” the grand jury and got a decision in a day and a half, I trust my source more on that issue. Plus the length does matter much, so long as they saw the evidence.

Out of towners may not care, but his opinion will have meaning in Louisville.

I wouldn’t really characterize Aubrey as “liberal” or “conservative.” But he is a very well known member of the defense bar and has been for a long time. He’s not the first guy I’d recommend for a defense lawyer, but he’s top 5, and Top 2 of the African American defense bar. (No. 1 is a former prosecutor forced to resign over an alcoholic beverage and a car. If you want beat a prosecutor, hire a prosecutor.)
 
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TDHoosier

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We always turn to harsher punishment (see crack) but when has ever worked for users or sellers?
Easy money is a gamble the sellers are willing to take, make it hurt is my mentality. Unfortunately I live next door to a former sellers parents (seller overdosed in a hotel 2 months ago, his 4th OD). He was arrested multiple time and just kept going back, I asked him one time why he said he just didn't want to hump it in my world. His parents are great people, own 40 acres with a nice home but they were enablers and the end result was 2 months ago. IMO after about the 6th arrest he should have had been a lifer?

Funny story about a month before he died the police came to my door asking if I has seen him, it was an old guy and a fairly young guy and it was about 10pm. After telling them I had not, I wished them good luck catching him with just those two, because it was never going to happen.
 

TDHoosier

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yep.....spending tons & tons of $ on this without the threat of sanctions is just $ down the drain, as My Team pointed out. You can do both, but the threat of punishment at some point is essential..........

See, for example, how spending boatloads of $ in LA & Seattle has cured the homeless problem.........
Absolutely, if reform is not wanted by the individuals then all the money won't solve a thing. Poor money into a sinking ship is never going to work.
 

INRanger27

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Easy money is a gamble the sellers are willing to take, make it hurt is my mentality. Unfortunately I live next door to a former sellers parents (seller overdosed in a hotel 2 months ago, his 4th OD). He was arrested multiple time and just kept going back, I asked him one time why he said he just didn't want to hump it in my world. His parents are great people, own 40 acres with a nice home but they were enablers and the end result was 2 months ago. IMO after about the 6th arrest he should have had been a lifer?

Funny story about a month before he died the police came to my door asking if I has seen him, it was an old guy and a fairly young guy and it was about 10pm. After telling them I had not, I wished them good luck catching him with just those two, because it was never going to happen.
Did he ever receive rehab or just prison?
 
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bawlmer

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Lawyer, former Louisville NAACP president says grand jury correct not to indict 2 officers in Breonna Taylor case

https://www.wdrb.com/news/lawyer-fo...cle_bcb5c4dc-feab-11ea-9813-73f9355c1765.html

I see Aubrey Williams every time I’m in our courthouse

While I see he claims that the AG “rushed” the grand jury and got a decision in a day and a half, I trust my source more on that issue. Plus the length does matter much, so long as they saw the evidence.

Out of towners may not care, but his opinion will have meaning in Louisville.

I wouldn’t really characterize Aubrey as “liberal” or “conservative.” But he is a very well known member of the defense bar and has been for a long time. He’s not the first guy I’d recommend for a defense lawyer, but he’s top 5, and Top 2 of the African American defense bar. (No. 1 is a former prosecutor forced to resign over an alcoholic beverage and a car. If you want beat a prosecutor, hire a prosecutor.)
It's good Mr. Williams is willing to speak out. Hopefully that will help people better understand it's not that the process is a complete sham.

But here's a different take from another former federal prosecutor, who is now a law professor at Georgetown. The author is Black.

I’m a former prosecutor. The charge in Breonna Taylor’s death is pathetically weak.

The article is behind the WaPo pay-wall, so here's the key section.

"I’m a former prosecutor, and I would have charged all three officers with manslaughter. I think murder would be overcharging, because the officers did not have the intent to kill Taylor. Still, if three gang members burst into an apartment, were met with gunfire by somebody in the home, and in response shot up the apartment complex and killed an innocent person, they would almost certainly be charged with homicide.

It’s no less of a crime when three cops do the same thing. Self-defense is an issue, but one that a jury should decide. We know the officers continued to fire long after any threat ceased. A neighbor called 911 to report gunfire, and 68 seconds into the call, you can still hear the shots. Further, under Kentucky law, you can’t claim self-defense if your actions placed innocent people in danger, as the police who killed Taylor obviously did."
 

mcmurtry66

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It's good Mr. Williams is willing to speak out. Hopefully that will help people better understand it's not that the process is a complete sham.

But here's a different take from another former federal prosecutor, who is now a law professor at Georgetown. The author is Black.

I’m a former prosecutor. The charge in Breonna Taylor’s death is pathetically weak.

The article is behind the WaPo pay-wall, so here's the key section.

"I’m a former prosecutor, and I would have charged all three officers with manslaughter. I think murder would be overcharging, because the officers did not have the intent to kill Taylor. Still, if three gang members burst into an apartment, were met with gunfire by somebody in the home, and in response shot up the apartment complex and killed an innocent person, they would almost certainly be charged with homicide.

It’s no less of a crime when three cops do the same thing. Self-defense is an issue, but one that a jury should decide. We know the officers continued to fire long after any threat ceased. A neighbor called 911 to report gunfire, and 68 seconds into the call, you can still hear the shots. Further, under Kentucky law, you can’t claim self-defense if your actions placed innocent people in danger, as the police who killed Taylor obviously did."
what an absolutely silly take comparing three gang members bursting into an apartment versus three cops authorized to be there.
1) the cops were authorized to be there.
2) the cops returned fire
hard to overcome those issues without stretching really far
 

TDHoosier

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Did he ever receive rehab or just prison?
Rehab several times, every time the parents got him out. As I stated they were enablers like most are when their little Johnny or Judy is like this. He was 46 when he passed, I had known him for well over 40 of those years the only thing he was ever good at was being bad. He never crossed me but he is one reason I slept with a gun near my bed.
 

MyTeamIsOnTheFloor

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It's good Mr. Williams is willing to speak out. Hopefully that will help people better understand it's not that the process is a complete sham.

But here's a different take from another former federal prosecutor, who is now a law professor at Georgetown. The author is Black.

I’m a former prosecutor. The charge in Breonna Taylor’s death is pathetically weak.

The article is behind the WaPo pay-wall, so here's the key section.

"I’m a former prosecutor, and I would have charged all three officers with manslaughter. I think murder would be overcharging, because the officers did not have the intent to kill Taylor. Still, if three gang members burst into an apartment, were met with gunfire by somebody in the home, and in response shot up the apartment complex and killed an innocent person, they would almost certainly be charged with homicide.

It’s no less of a crime when three cops do the same thing. Self-defense is an issue, but one that a jury should decide. We know the officers continued to fire long after any threat ceased. A neighbor called 911 to report gunfire, and 68 seconds into the call, you can still hear the shots. Further, under Kentucky law, you can’t claim self-defense if your actions placed innocent people in danger, as the police who killed Taylor obviously did."
He's wrong from a distance.

Factually and legally.

Thank God he is no longer in power.

The most liberal person I know - and they are a vast majority here and he is left of left (this state and city have been run by Democrats since the Civil War until very recently - when GOP started to win federal races) - is also a former prosecutor - and even he acknowledges you cannot charge the 2 cops who fired back after the boyfriend fired first, even the one who actually shot her.

People like this professor - who lump everything together - are dangerous. They are willing to ignore the law.

By the time the cop who was charged with wanton endangerment fired his first shot - which was outside and "aimed" at neighboring apartments - Breonna Taylor was already dead. His actions had ZERO to do with her death, but this fool professor wants two other people charged with manslaughter because of what he did.

Be GLEEFUL that this professor was removed from power.
 

INRanger27

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It's good Mr. Williams is willing to speak out. Hopefully that will help people better understand it's not that the process is a complete sham.

But here's a different take from another former federal prosecutor, who is now a law professor at Georgetown. The author is Black.

I’m a former prosecutor. The charge in Breonna Taylor’s death is pathetically weak.

The article is behind the WaPo pay-wall, so here's the key section.

"I’m a former prosecutor, and I would have charged all three officers with manslaughter. I think murder would be overcharging, because the officers did not have the intent to kill Taylor. Still, if three gang members burst into an apartment, were met with gunfire by somebody in the home, and in response shot up the apartment complex and killed an innocent person, they would almost certainly be charged with homicide.

It’s no less of a crime when three cops do the same thing. Self-defense is an issue, but one that a jury should decide. We know the officers continued to fire long after any threat ceased. A neighbor called 911 to report gunfire, and 68 seconds into the call, you can still hear the shots. Further, under Kentucky law, you can’t claim self-defense if your actions placed innocent people in danger, as the police who killed Taylor obviously did."
I have to imagine that the kids who come out of his/her class are poorly trained lawyers. That’s a hot take from a professor at a good school.
 

INRanger27

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Rehab several times, every time the parents got him out. As I stated they were enablers like most are when their little Johnny or Judy is like this. He was 46 when he passed, I had known him for well over 40 of those years the only thing he was ever good at was being bad. He never crossed me but he is one reason I slept with a gun near my bed.
You mean they removed him from rehab?
 

bawlmer

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He's wrong from a distance.

Factually and legally.

Thank God he is no longer in power.

The most liberal person I know - and they are a vast majority here and he is left of left (this state and city have been run by Democrats since the Civil War until very recently - when GOP started to win federal races) - is also a former prosecutor - and even he acknowledges you cannot charge the 2 cops who fired back after the boyfriend fired first, even the one who actually shot her.

People like this professor - who lump everything together - are dangerous. They are willing to ignore the law.

By the time the cop who was charged with wanton endangerment fired his first shot - which was outside and "aimed" at neighboring apartments - Breonna Taylor was already dead. His actions had ZERO to do with her death, but this fool professor wants two other people charged with manslaughter because of what he did.

Be GLEEFUL that this professor was removed from power.
I appreciate your thoughts. This is the first I heard that Taylor was dead before the cop who was charged fired his gun. I've not followed this case closely and wondered exactly what was different about the actions of the cop who was fired and charged. I assume the other 2 acted with more control, and presumably had more line of sight into the apartment if they knew Taylor was mortally wounded.

what an absolutely silly take comparing three gang members bursting into an apartment versus three cops authorized to be there.
1) the cops were authorized to be there.
2) the cops returned fire
hard to overcome those issues without stretching really far
It may seem silly to you and me, but I'm willing to consider it isn't silly to some in the Black community who may feel the police go beyond their legitimate authority and use unnecessary force in situations like this. I did find it particularly questionable that gunshots continued for over a minute in response to a single shot.
 
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mcmurtry66

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I appreciate your thoughts. This is the first I heard that Taylor was dead before the cop who was charged fired his gun. I've not followed this case closely and wondered exactly what was different about the actions of the cop who was fired and charged. I assume the other 2 acted with more control, and presumably had more line of sight into the apartment if they knew Taylor was mortally wounded.



It may seem silly to you and me, but I'm willing to consider it isn't silly to some in the Black community who may feel the police go beyond their legitimate authority and use unnecessary force in situations like this. I did find it particularly questionable that gunshots continued for over a minute in response to a single shot.
I hear ya. I think if you’re in a confined space and someone shoots even once you’re going to have a suicide by cop scenario. With the story told I don’t have a problem with how the cops conducted themselves. Whether they needed to be there at 1 am initiating all that is another story.
 
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hoosboot

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I hear ya. I think if you’re in a confined space and someone shoots even once you’re going to have a suicide by cop scenario. With the story told I don’t have a problem with how the cops conducted themselves. Whether they needed to be there at 1 am initiating all that is another story.
One of the things that I think is important to eventually get back to is separating the legal ramifications of what happened here and the better law enforcement outcomes we need in relation to what happened here. I'm skeptical that the case would have been approached similarly in a suburban or rural setting and I think that gets to the core of some of the conversation.
 
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T.M.P.

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Whether they needed to be there at 1 am initiating all that is another story.
That's the issue I'm having with this whole scenario. They blamed and tried the wrong people. The officers on scene were not at fault, they were just part of a botched operation with bad intel. The superiors who planned the operation and the officer in charge, are at fault, and should be the ones held accountable.
 

INRanger27

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That's the issue I'm having with this whole scenario. They blamed and tried the wrong people. The officers on scene were not at fault, they were just part of a botched operation with bad intel. The superiors who planned the operation and the officer in charge, are at fault, and should be the ones held accountable.
They’re civilly liable and the city has settled. They’re not criminally liable because it wasn’t an illegal plan. It was just an awful plan.