Let’s see where Lander is. Give him two 6 minute stretches, more if he’s playing ok. Establish a live game baseline. It’s crazy the way he plays 1 or 2 minutes and is out. Leal provided steady minutes tonight, but he gave up back to back 3’s by being late to cover his man, and Archie allowed him to keep stay in the game. This Lander thing and Archie is weird! Go Hoosier!
Arch’, give Lander some minutes
- Thread starter bdhman
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Lander is going to transfer. But I don’t see the kid ever being more than Rob Phinisee.
He’s not ready for the speed of the game yet. He’s out of position more than anyone. I’d like to see him get more minutes too, but unfortunately we can’t afford to have him in the game right now. I’m assuming he knows where he stands with the staff by now and what he needs to do to play more. It’s not on Arch, it’s on him to get better
You may be right, but for now it’s a guess because he hasn’t played enough in games to know anything. If he does transfer, it’s a huge negative ROI for Archie. IU ain’t Uk or Duke or UNC, where each class has multiple 5 star recruits. If Archie saw a major deficiency, why not have Lander stay in HS or pass on him? Very strange.
I agree only thing i would say is at some point you have to let a kid play through mistakes, the very best leal will ever be is a galloway clone. the minutes leal got tonight might have been a good time to give lander a 4 or 5 minute run
Believe me, I’m trying to be objective. Geronimo and Leal have had longer stretches, not always very productive. Either don’t play him, or give him more than a minute or two. I don’t see this having a happy ending. Hope I’m wrong.
If he would have played what you suggest, we probably lose the game.
Leal was only out of position about 40% of the time. Lander is out of position about 75% of the time. You can afford to ride it out a little more you’re not giving up so much on D. I thought Leal rotated well tonight for the most part. Lander made a careless turnover and then didn’t hustle after the live ball. He tends to be a ball stopper on Offense too. He’s got a ways to go yet.
Respectfully, you don’t know that. You are assuming his productivity in playing 8 minutes would be exactly like what he shows in 1 minute. That’s counterfactual, and I could just as well say IU wins by 15 and would have never trailed by 10 if he had played . The point is, who knows...Archie recruited Lander, let him play a little and see what happens. Risk and Reward.
Seriously? You are the most pessimistic, gloom and doom poster on the board. You haven’t enjoyed an IU football or basketball game in 20 years. How miserable are you?
That’s a fair point, but I have watched every game we have played this season and every play he has been on the floor. There is nothing I have seen to suggest he helps us more than he hurts us. Maybe we will see more of him but when he plays, he appears to only be concerned with himself offensively and is completely lost / liability defensively.
Fair enough. I will say that I am impressed with the body language of the Frosh, including Lander, when they are on the bench during time outs. Upbeat, chatty and cheering on their teammates. Nice to see.
This was the best Leal looked all year. He’s improving.
The one I replied to, of course, and I could name several more. They know who they are and will probably post in response.
Ok Aloha Hoosier. For what it’s worth, I graduated from HS in the 808 in 75’ and am a 80’ IU grad, too.
Do U ever have anything to say about basketball? Seems like you just lurk around waiting to attack people personally if they don't agree CAM is God. How miserable are you?
Lander is a 17 year old high school kid without no offseason, no exhibition games ect...
If he wants to play more he needs to stop getting out of position on defense, until he does he's not going to play. Archie is a defense minded coach.
If he wants to play more he needs to stop getting out of position on defense, until he does he's not going to play. Archie is a defense minded coach.
That's true to a certain extent, but some kids, regardless of their flaws, just need to be let loose and go win. Think IT, and even RMK recognized that. I could give a shit how good our stupid, gimmick defense is in a year, just let the kid loose and make us a watchable product for as long as he's here
Our "gimmick" defense has gotten better every year and is now ranked #9 on Kenpom. As usual, you don't know what the hell you're talking about.
This team has flaws but defense isn't one of them.
18* turned in early august. Older than OG as a freshmen and within days of TB and Noah when they were here. All had summer bdays and no more than 60 days apart.
not 17, and should not be a senior. Could be a senior, but def could be a freshmen too. Nothin abnormal about him being young. Fatjohns tried to paint that picture, don’t buy into it.
I’m not miserable at all, thank you. I’m enjoying life. I recommend it. I also don’t care if you think Miller is God or not, I certainly don’t think it.
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It’s called being a “realist.” If enough IU fans will finally get tired of being mediocre maybe we can force the administration to finally do something. The money needs to dry up when Covid-19 is over.
Guarding the three on defense is one of or problems. Maryland missed a lot of open ones that good teams will make. We are tied for 9th worse in conference at opponents 3P%. Lot of snipers in this league.
A realist would have realistic posts. A realist would be able to realistically assess the situation rather than letting his emotions lead him by the nose. You gave up on the FSU game last year less than half way through the first half. IU won the game handily.
IU played good defense as usual, rebounded better. The Freshmen played a bit more and Leal, in particular, looked much better. Shooting was horrible, missing easy shots inside and out. Definitely frustrating there. Hopefully that was the worst shooting game of the year and Franklin comes back soon.
The same people complaining about his minutes would be complaining ten fold if IU lost one of the last two games playing someone that isn’t ready.
I mean I like Lander, but what has he shown so far to deserve minutes over the other guards on the team? He’s really struggled so far on his defensive rotations. The truth is nobody would even be discussing this right now if he was’t a 5* out of high school.
Some guys take longer to develop, not everyone is a one and done or two and done type player. I don’t care what he was ranked out of high school, the lack of patience with this kid is astounding.
Well when he is literally last on the depth chart and our guard play is some of the worst in conference it is a bit head scratching ya? You are getting he is not ready by the 1:45 seconds he got yesterday? Rob dribbled off his D twice on Offense, and he continues to chase his brother Romeo for worse 3P% in a year. At the end of the game we looked like a chicken with our head cut off trying to dribble and pass against the Maryland press. Lander can dribble and pass better than all of our guards combined.
Rob and Durham have struggled no doubt, that said they are significantly better than Lander right now defensively. Rob is one of the best defensive point guards in the conference. Bottom line is that Archie will play him more when he improves his defense. Until then his minutes will be limited.
I am cool with that if we win. However, we start losing some of these games, it will be because of guard play, and if he doesnt play when we are losing, I have problems with that.
Mainly because I do not want him to transfer. If IU were a top 5 team in conference it would be one thing, but if we are gonna finish 10th and Archie loses Lander to transferring, he should be Fired on the spot. You just dont get 5 stars to reclassify. Hell IU gets a 5 star once every 3 years or so on average? He has tons of potential and I do not want to lose him.
Don’t disagree with anything here but you have to look at it from Archie’s point of view. He has to play the players that are going to give him the best chance to win on a game to game basis, because if not he won’t have a job.
I do not agree that Rob gives us the best chance playing 31 minutes. IMO Lander should have played at least 10 of those. Rob is spotty as a defender. Recently I will admit he has been freaking very good, but he takes mental lapses.
The perception that IU is bad a defending the 3 is wrong too. IU was third in the B1G in opponents' 3PT percentage at 31% before the game just barely behind Minnesota and Rutgers. Maryland shot 28% last night on 25 tries so IU will improve slightly in that stat. IU rebounded a lot better last night and outrebounded Maryland by 10. You're right that defense is not the problem and the stats prove it. So does the eye test for those of us that love to watch good defense. They had some lapses on defense mostly by our Freshmen which happens, but IU won because of defense. Our problem has been shooting and that is still our problem. 37% overall and 18% from three last night. That's is horrible and has to improve.
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Its ridiculous he doesn’t play 10+ minutes a game. Hunter committed 3 really dumb fouls in the 2nd half and Archie continued to play him. The 4 healthy guards in front of Lander went a combined 6-25 from the field and they continued to play. At some point Archie might want to figure out his offense sucks and give Lander a little more time.
His age is irrelevant. It's the fact that he went from being a high school junior to a college freshman without any kind of summer workout program and a delayed fall practice. It's a very real possibility that Lander didn't step foot in Bloomington until late August/early September. That's monumental especially when playing in such a deep and rugged conference such as the B10. Have you watched him play this year? Not only does he look like he's still in high school, but plays like it too. There's a reason you're seeing so many true freshman struggle this year, sans a few who were already physically ready, and it's because they lacked the acclimation period from early summer to the start of fall practice due to the pandemic.
I don't care how long Archie plays Lander, but he shouldn't be playing if he's not versed on defense and out of control on offense which have both been his biggest issues. If Archie losses a "5*" because he didn't get playing time due to his own accord, then so be it. Done with ego's. It's been IU's achiles heel that last few years.
The perception that IU is bad a defending the 3 is wrong too. IU was third in the B1G in opponents' 3PT percentage at 31% before the game just barely behind Minnesota and Rutgers. Maryland shot 28% last night on 25 tries so IU will improve slightly in that stat. IU rebounded a lot better last night and outrebounded Maryland by 10. You're right that defense is not the problem and the stats prove it. So does the eye test for those of us that love to watch good defense. They had some lapses on defense mostly by our Freshmen which happens, but IU won because of defense. Our problem has been shooting and that is still our problem. 37% overall and 18% from three last night. That's is horrible and has to improve.
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Discover the current NCAA Division I Men's Basketball leaders in every stats category, as well as historic leaders.
it’s not perception when you look at conference stats. It’s fact. IU is allowing 36% from deep in conference tied for 9th. Maryland missed a lot of wide open ones.
well I really disagree with this. I want IU to compete for final fours, need 5 stars to do that. Lander not playing is sending a message to future recruits, that is part of it. They are looking at how he is being used. Not playing at all, transferring, and god forbid flourishing elsewhere would be a program killer.
we are not elite enough where we can just have 5 stars leave like UK. Have to make it work. Romeo was one pick away of falling out of the lottery, he wasn’t a success story at IU. If you are a top 3 recruit you should be in the lottery. Archie needs to hit on Lander now or later in his career.
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