Al Franken's a chickenshit

[iuwclurker1]

At least Louis CK admitted what he did and didn't try to slough it off. Franken's too much a coward to admit his wrongdoing. Shame on him. He's no better than Roy Moore at this point. Even worse, really. No accusation so far that Moore stuck his tongue in anyone's mouth, is there?

Furthermore, Franken lost all credibility chiding Sessions for his memory lapses.

Franken needs to resign. Today. Or else democratic senators have nothing to say about Moore.

Either that or come clean. #ComeCleanOrResign.

 

[outside shooter]

 

[Thyrsis]

At least Louis CK admitted what he did and didn't try to slough it off. Franken's too much a coward to admit his wrongdoing. Shame on him. He's no better than Roy Moore at this point. Even worse, really. No accusation so far that Moore stuck his tongue in anyone's mouth, is there?

Furthermore, Franken lost all credibility chiding Sessions for his memory lapses.

Franken needs to resign. Today. Or else democratic senators have nothing to say about Moore.

Either that or come clean. #ComeCleanOrResign.

Wut?

That strikes me as some over the top false equivalency unless there's a lot more about Franken out there that's not in the story. That doesn't mean Franken's reported forced kiss or inappropriate picture are okay, but that's pretty far removed from the essence of the profoundly problematic issues surrounding guys like Weinstein, Cosby, Spacey, Moore, Halperin, etc. and the culture that tolerates it. Franken may even be a link in the same chain for all I know, but saying it's factually exactly all the same thing (or worse?) tends to nullify the problem, I think.

 

[Rockfish1]

Wut?

That strikes me as some over the top false equivalency unless there's a lot more about Franken out there that's not in the story. That doesn't mean Franken's reported forced kiss or inappropriate picture are okay, but that's pretty far removed from the essence of the profoundly problematic issues surrounding guys like Weinstein, Cosby, Spacey, Moore, Halperin, etc. and the culture that tolerates it. Franken may even be a link in the same chain for all I know, but saying it's factually exactly all the same thing (or worse?) tends to nullify the problem, I think.

In particular, while Franken had no business using the sleeping Tweeden as a prop for an off color photo, he's not groping her breasts. Just as the flak jacket protected Tweeden's chest from bullets, so did it protect her from Franken's fingers. I think that's not a photo of Franken groping Tweeden, but a photo of Franken pretending to grope Tweeden. Not appropriate, but not nearly equivalent to Weinstein, Ailes, Moore, Spacey, etc.

The real question for Franken is whether there's more out there. Was this a one-off, or is he a bad guy? I suspect we'll find out.

 

[Thyrsis]

In particular, while Franken had no business using the sleeping Tweeden as a prop for an off color photo, he's not groping her breasts. Just as the flak jacket protected Tweeden's chest from bullets, so did it protect her from Franken's fingers. I think that's not a photo of Franken groping Tweeden, but a photo of Franken pretending to grope Tweeden. Not appropriate, but not nearly equivalent to Weinstein, Ailes, Moore, Spacey, etc.

The real question for Franken is whether there's more out there. Was this a one-off, or is he a bad guy? I suspect we'll find out.

I would have no idea. After all, I don't know these people and don't pretend to know them. But going off only the limited bios we have of both, it wouldn't shock me to learn that Franken's behavior was, at least in part, a purposeful expression of his disrespect due to either her politics or her career background. That doesn't make it better, of course. Instead, it would relate a motivation (which, if true, would still be an objectionable act (of objectification to boot) against a woman). But that's different than routinely abusing positions of power to abuse women for sexual gratification over a long period of time and fostering a broader culture of mistreatment and corruption. And I don't say that to suggest her politics (she's been a conservative voice on shows like Hannity) or background (she's been a pinup type model, etc.) make her fair game; the opposite is true, of course.

Maybe that's Franken too. I don't know. We'll see.

 

[Bill4411]

Apparently she is frequently on Hannity's show and/or in Playboy magazine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leeann_Tweeden

I don't see that this is the same as trying to seduce a 14 year old. BTW if we start investigating all previous behavior of congressmen I wonder who will be left, or which of our Presidents since WWI?

 

[Noodle]

In particular, while Franken had no business using the sleeping Tweeden as a prop for an off color photo, he's not groping her breasts. Just as the flak jacket protected Tweeden's chest from bullets, so did it protect her from Franken's fingers. I think that's not a photo of Franken groping Tweeden, but a photo of Franken pretending to grope Tweeden. Not appropriate, but not nearly equivalent to Weinstein, Ailes, Moore, Spacey, etc.

The real question for Franken is whether there's more out there. Was this a one-off, or is he a bad guy? I suspect we'll find out.

One of the things about this photo that puzzles me is that it was taken on a C-17 military transport flying from Afghanistan. That means in addition to the photographer, there were almost certainly other military personnel on the flight. Did anyone at least tell Franken "hey, douchebag, that's not cool"? OK, "hey, Senator Douchebag, that's not acceptable behavior"? Or do we really have a shortage of real men in our military as well. (I say real men because I have a hard time believing that any woman present when the photo was taken would have remained silent).

And on top of being a douchebag, how stupid is Franken to pose for such a picture? Stunt or something more, it's shows an extreme lack of common sense (not to mention decency) on the part of Franken.

Given the onslaught of these stories, I suspect there are more and more politicians and other public figures that are not sleeping all that well of late.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Apparently she is frequently on Hannity's show and/or in Playboy magazine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leeann_Tweeden

I don't see that this is the same as trying to seduce a 14 year old. BTW if we start investigating all previous behavior of congressmen I wonder who will be left, or many of our Presidents since WWI.

You guys are a joke. Either it is wrong to treat women this way or it is not. Whether someone is on team D or team R should not matter.

Your first sentence is slut shaming and blaming the victim. Rock and Thyrsis do a good job of jumping into whataboutism. Rock goes so far as to say the flak jacket protects Tweeden from actually being groped. Moore is a dirty old perv who chased after teenage skirts but I have not seen that he has been accused of forcing himself on a female (of any age) and groping them. Although apparently if he groped a lady while she was wearing a thick jacket that would be okay since he was not really groping her breasts, right Rock?

My thought has always been that many (most) of the positions taken by liberals come with an out clause as long as the perpetrator plays for the right team. Rape away Bill. Whip your dick out Harvey and force women to play with it. Slut shame and shout down accusers of Bubba, Gloria. It is all good because you play for the right team.

Hypocrites.

 

[UncleMark]

Franken is going to have to lay low for a while, that's for sure. And you can bet the Pubs are going to make political hay out of this.

That said, and I guess I'm a douche for even saying this, but do a Google Image search on her. Then tell me if you don't think her outrage and disgust isn't a bit overblown.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Franken is going to have to lay low for a while, that's for sure. And you can bet the Pubs are going to make political hay out of this.

That said, and I guess I'm a douche for even saying this, but do a Google Image search on her. Then tell me if you don't think her outrage and disgust isn't a bit overblown.

So if she dresses and acts a certain way she is asking for it huh?

And supposedly conservative men are waging the war on women. Hey Zeke, these guys are on your squad. Hope the girls you work with dress in Hijabs, otherwise they are just begging for it.

 

[Thyrsis]

You guys are a joke. Either it is wrong to treat women this way or it is not. Whether someone is on team D or team R should not matter.

Your first sentence is slut shaming and blaming the victim. Rock and Thyrsis do a good job of jumping into whataboutism. Rock goes so far as to say the flak jacket protects Tweeden from actually being groped. Moore is a dirty old perv who chased after teenage skirts but I have not seen that he has been accused of forcing himself on a female (of any age) and groping them. Although apparently if he groped a lady while she was wearing a thick jacket that would be okay since he was not really groping her breasts, right Rock?

My thought has always been that many (most) of the positions taken by liberals come with an out clause as long as the perpetrator plays for the right team. Rape away Bill. Whip your dick out Harvey and force women to play with it. Slut shame and shout down accusers of Bubba, Gloria. It is all good because you play for the right team.

Hypocrites.

Your post is a joke, not least because most of it is just made up. But that's part and parcel of being a Republican these days.

Disclaimer for the billionth time: that's not about conservatives, libertarians, liberals, etc. It's about what that Party and team (regardless of political theory purportedly underpinning it) represent today.

 

[UncleMark]

So if she dresses and acts a certain way she is asking for it huh?

And supposedly conservative men are waging the war on women. Hey Zeke, these guys are on your squad. Hope the girls you work with dress in Hijabs, otherwise they are just begging for it.

I was sure that would get a self righteous reply. Enjoy.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Your post is a joke, not least because most of it is just made up. But that's part and parcel of being a Republican these days.

Disclaimer for the billionth time: that's not about conservatives, libertarians, liberals, etc. It's about what that Party and team (regardless of political theory purportedly underpinning it) represent today.

In fairness, you were not the worst offender. However, I will let what you and the other left leaning individuals in this thread posted and what I posted stand and let others be the judge.

 

[Thyrsis]

In fairness, you were not the worst offender. However, I will let what you and the other left leaning individuals in this thread posted and what I posted stand and let others be the judge.

No, you distorted and misrepresented. Was that on purpose? If not, what explains it?

 

[IUCrazy2]

I was sure that would get a self righteous reply. Enjoy.

Wear that sexism as a badge of honor. Just remember the next time that you try and go off on some rant about conservatives being anti-women that you were the one advocating sexually assaulting females who dress or present themselves in a certain way because they were asking for it.

Again, hypocrites...not all of you but a damn sizable portion of you.

 

[Bill4411]

[
Your first sentence is slut shaming and blaming the victim. Rock and Thyrsis do a good job of jumping into whataboutism. Rock goes so far as to say the flak jacket protects Tweeden from actually being groped. Moore is a dirty old perv who chased after teenage skirts but I have not seen that he has been accused of forcing himself on a female (of any age) and groping them. Although apparently if he groped a lady while she was wearing a thick jacket that would be okay since he was not really groping her breasts, right Rock?

My thought has always been that many (most) of the positions taken by liberals come with an out clause as long as the perpetrator plays for the right team. Rape away Bill. Whip your dick out Harvey and force women to play with it. Slut shame and shout down accusers of Bubba, Gloria. It is all good because you play for the right team.

Hypocrites.[/QUOTE]
And you don't think this came out as vindication for Old Roy's behavior? So are you calling for Judge Roy to step down because of his actions? Tweeden should be set-up nicely for a Fox News position now as she sure fits the stereotype of that network to a T.

 

[IUCrazy2]

No, you distorted and misrepresented. Was that on purpose? If not, what explains it?

Well let's see:

Apparently she is frequently on Hannity's show and/or in Playboy magazine

So she was asking for it? I mean a conservative woman and a playboy poser, she deserves to be groped and ridiculed right?

That said, and I guess I'm a douche for even saying this, but do a Google Image search on her. Then tell me if you don't think her outrage and disgust isn't a bit overblown.

See above.

In particular, while Franken had no business using the sleeping Tweeden as a prop for an off color photo, he's not groping her breasts. Just as the flak jacket protected Tweeden's chest from bullets, so did it protect her from Franken's fingers.

Although he should not have done it, it was not really touching her because the thick flak jacket protected her from actually being groped. So I guess Rock needs to let us know how thick or thin clothing needs to be before we get a real grope.

But that's different than routinely abusing positions of power to abuse women for sexual gratification over a long period of time and fostering a broader culture of mistreatment and corruption.

What Franken did was bad but it was not as bad as.....so how is that not "whataboutism"? Do you think Tweeden gives a shit whether she was groped and had a tongue shoved down her throat for giggles or for power? I would think she is pissed because it happened at all.

 

[IUCrazy2]

[
Your first sentence is slut shaming and blaming the victim. Rock and Thyrsis do a good job of jumping into whataboutism. Rock goes so far as to say the flak jacket protects Tweeden from actually being groped. Moore is a dirty old perv who chased after teenage skirts but I have not seen that he has been accused of forcing himself on a female (of any age) and groping them. Although apparently if he groped a lady while she was wearing a thick jacket that would be okay since he was not really groping her breasts, right Rock?

My thought has always been that many (most) of the positions taken by liberals come with an out clause as long as the perpetrator plays for the right team. Rape away Bill. Whip your dick out Harvey and force women to play with it. Slut shame and shout down accusers of Bubba, Gloria. It is all good because you play for the right team.

Hypocrites.

And you don't think this came out as vindication for Old Roy's behavior? So are you calling for Judge Roy to step down because of his actions? Tweeden should be set-up nicely for a Fox News position now as she sure fits the stereotype of that network to a T.[/QUOTE]


Yes, the judge should step down. Should Al?

 

[UncleMark]

you were the one advocating sexually assaulting females who dress or present themselves in a certain way because they were asking for it.

LOL. That's what you read into my post? Are you drinking? Or just going crazy to get in your LIBS DO IT TOO zingers?

 

[IUCrazy2]

LOL. That's what you read into my post? Are you drinking? Or just going crazy to get in your LIBS DO IT TOO zingers?

Nah, it's good Mark. She posed naked. You can Google search it. So any complaints she has are overblown.

 

[Bill4411]

And you don't think this came out as vindication for Old Roy's behavior? So are you calling for Judge Roy to step down because of his actions? Tweeden should be set-up nicely for a Fox News position now as she sure fits the stereotype of that network to a T.

Yes, the judge should step down. Should Al?[/QUOTE]
Maybe if more would come out. I always wondered about his SNL days because that was a free wheeling drug ingesting bunch; however, that probably applies to a lot of Congress. Maybe they should have to be vetted better before they can stand for office? There appears to be some real low-life's in Washington.

 

[Rockfish1]

Well let's see:



So she was asking for it? I mean a conservative woman and a playboy poser, she deserves to be groped and ridiculed right?



See above.



Although he should not have done it, it was not really touching her because the thick flak jacket protected her from actually being groped. So I guess Rock needs to let us know how thick or thin clothing needs to be before we get a real grope.



What Franken did was bad but it was not as bad as.....so how is that not "whataboutism"? Do you think Tweeden gives a shit whether she was groped and had a tongue shoved down her throat for giggles or for power? I would think she is pissed because it happened at all.

Your posts in this thread are stupid. On one hand we have people like Ailes, Weinstein, Spacey, and Moore who spent careers abusing power relationships to extract sexual favors from vulnerable women in a culture that condoned what they did and shielded them from consequence. This thing with Franken is not remotely like that, just as a geriatric GHWB groping women from his wheelchair wasn't remotely like that. Still wrong, but not equivalent.

Maybe it will turn out that Franken is a bad guy like the others. If so, screw him. But in the meantime, it helps no one to insist on foolish consistencies. We should treat like things alike, but not all things are the same. If you can't see that, then I can't help you.

______________________________________

Also, and I'd really rather not get in the weeds in this response, but if someone touches your flak jacket, can they feel your breasts? Can you feel their hands? My guess is no. Also, it doesn't appear in the picture that Franken is actually touching the flak jacket. He's pretending to grope a sleeping woman for an off color photo. He had no business doing that, and Tweeden is certainly within her rights to take offense at being so used, but it's not remotely equivalent to anything the others are accused of.

 

[dahldc]

Yes, the judge should step down. Should Al?

Should the POTUS?


Let's face it, this is all disgusting and it's the kind of behavior most men have been conducting for centuries. That doesn't in the least make it right.

Let's just call a spade a spade. It's bullshit that men act like this.

 

[HillzHoozier]

In particular, while Franken had no business using the sleeping Tweeden as a prop for an off color photo, he's not groping her breasts. Just as the flak jacket protected Tweeden's chest from bullets, so did it protect her from Franken's fingers. I think that's not a photo of Franken groping Tweeden, but a photo of Franken pretending to grope Tweeden. Not appropriate, but not nearly equivalent to Weinstein, Ailes, Moore, Spacey, etc.

The real question for Franken is whether there's more out there. Was this a one-off, or is he a bad guy? I suspect we'll find out.

How I wish this was something, because I'm in no way a fan of Franken, but for heaven's sake with some of this stuff aleready. #dustinhoffmansaidclitoris

 

[Rockfish1]

Franken echoes McConnell's call for an ethics investigation of Tweeden's allegations and says he'll cooperate fully.

 

[UncleMark]

Nah, it's good Mark. She posed naked. You can Google search it. So any complaints she has are overblown.

Once again, can you show me where I advocated sexually assaulting her? Could it be your protestations are overblown?

 

[dahldc]

Franken echoes McConnell's call for an ethics investigation of Tweeden's allegations and says he'll cooperate fully.

That's almost like taking the high road and saying this is the way it should be done.

Should have just tweeted about her and called her a loser.

 

[UncleMark]

Franken echoes McConnell's call for an ethics investigation of Tweeden's allegations and says he'll cooperate fully.

I'm confused. I thought he was a chickenshit.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I reserve the right to revise and extend my remarks. At the moment, censure sounds acceptable.

 

[iuwclurker1]

Clearly you folks didn't read the WAPO article. He stuck his tongue in her mouth during an unwelcomed kiss and now he's sloughing it off. The equivalence I'm objecting to is that, unlike Louis CK, he's not coming out and admitting to his wrongdoing. That's precisely what makes him the same as all these other scumballs. From the WAPO article (my emphasis):

But on the day of the show, she wrote, “Franken and I were alone backstage going over our lines one last time. He said to me, “We need to rehearse the kiss.” I laughed and ignored him. Then he said it again. I said something like, ‘Relax Al, this isn’t SNL…we don’t need to rehearse the kiss.’

He continued to insist, and I was beginning to get uncomfortable.

He repeated that actors really need to rehearse everything and that we must practice the kiss. I said ‘OK’ so he would stop badgering me. We did the line leading up to the kiss and then he came at me, put his hand on the back of my head, mashed his lips against mine and aggressively stuck his tongue in my mouth.

I immediately pushed him away with both of my hands against his chest and told him if he ever did that to me again I wouldn’t be so nice about it the next time.
I walked away. All I could think about was getting to a bathroom as fast as possible to rinse the taste of him out of my mouth.

I felt disgusted and violated.
​

In a statement, Franken said: “I certainly don’t remember the rehearsal for the skit in the same way, but I send my sincerest apologies to Leeann. As to the photo, it was clearly intended to be funny but wasn’t. I shouldn’t have done it.”​

Franken knows full well he stuck his tongue in her mouth. Otherwise, he'd outright deny it. He didn't. Furthermore, that statement shows virtually no sincerity. Guilty as charged. This isn't even an incident from three decades ago but 2006. He needs to come clean to establish any credibility or get the hell out of Washington.

 

[twenty02]

You guys are a joke. Either it is wrong to treat women this way or it is not. Whether someone is on team D or team R should not matter.

Your first sentence is slut shaming and blaming the victim. Rock and Thyrsis do a good job of jumping into whataboutism. Rock goes so far as to say the flak jacket protects Tweeden from actually being groped. Moore is a dirty old perv who chased after teenage skirts but I have not seen that he has been accused of forcing himself on a female (of any age) and groping them. Although apparently if he groped a lady while she was wearing a thick jacket that would be okay since he was not really groping her breasts, right Rock?

My thought has always been that many (most) of the positions taken by liberals come with an out clause as long as the perpetrator plays for the right team. Rape away Bill. Whip your dick out Harvey and force women to play with it. Slut shame and shout down accusers of Bubba, Gloria. It is all good because you play for the right team.

Hypocrites.

You are incorrect about what Moore has been accused of.

 

[crazed_hoosier2]

Wear that sexism as a badge of honor. Just remember the next time that you try and go off on some rant about conservatives being anti-women that you were the one advocating sexually assaulting females who dress or present themselves in a certain way because they were asking for it.

Again, hypocrites...not all of you but a damn sizable portion of you.

Hypocrisy abounds when it comes to politics, IUCrazy.

That was my point a while back about Bill Clinton -- and finally that got to the point where Goat (I think it was Goat, he can correct me if I'm wrong) could only say that he didn't believe one or more of Clinton's accusers.

Democrats didn't defend WJC, vote for him twice, etc. etc. because they didn't believe the accusations. They may have cited that as the reason -- in fact, they might have even convinced themselves of it. But I'd argue that they did so because, for them, he was simply better than the alternative.

So, when people ask me how I could possibly vote for a douchebag like Donald Trump, I'm just stripping away all the pretense. It's not because I think he's actually better than he presents himself or any other contrived reason. I voted for him because I suspect his election would bring more of the types of policies I want and fewer of the types of policies I don't want.

Some may scoff at that. But at least I'm honest about it.

 

[MrBing]

At least Louis CK admitted what he did and didn't try to slough it off. Franken's too much a coward to admit his wrongdoing. Shame on him. He's no better than Roy Moore at this point. Even worse, really. No accusation so far that Moore stuck his tongue in anyone's mouth, is there?

Furthermore, Franken lost all credibility chiding Sessions for his memory lapses.

Franken needs to resign. Today. Or else democratic senators have nothing to say about Moore.

Either that or come clean. #ComeCleanOrResign.

I don't think they are the same. It's not right if it's true but it is only one woman and she's not a teenager. 30 something Judge Pervert was hot after teenage girls and tried to have sex with them. That includes a 14 year old. Looks as if Judge Pervert also failed to have sex with the girls so he's also a yuge failure. Lucky for the girls!

 

[iuwclurker1]

Apparently she is frequently on Hannity's show and/or in Playboy magazine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leeann_Tweeden

I don't see that this is the same as trying to seduce a 14 year old. BTW if we start investigating all previous behavior of congressmen I wonder who will be left, or which of our Presidents since WWI?

Sincere apologies and remorse are incompatible with denying the accuser's story. That's what Franken's statement did and that's unconscionable. For liberals to suggest otherwise is utter hypocrisy and offensive to anyone who's ever been sexually harassed or assaulted in any way.

 

[Thyrsis]

You guys are a joke.

You'll need to be more specific here. Who are "you guys" and what exactly did "those guys" say that makes them a joke? Can you confirm you're not calling me a joke?

Either it is wrong to treat women this way or it is not.

"This way" is an important part. What is "this way"? Do you see no material difference whatsoever between the contents in the article and what Weinstein, Space, Halperin, Ailes, etc. have been accused of?

Whether someone is on team D or team R should not matter.

Who says it does?? Weinstein is reportedly a Democrat and has been active in advocating for Democrats. I think Spacey is too. They're among the worst of the worst. Who is saying otherwise?

Your first sentence is slut shaming and blaming the victim.

I specifically said that nothing in her political and professional background would warrant what Franken is alleged to have done.

Rock and Thyrsis do a good job of jumping into whataboutism.

No, I rejected lurker's comparison with Moore. I accurately explained how Franken's actions as described in the article aren't comparable with those of Moore or Weinstein or Spacey or Ailes.

Rock goes so far as to say the flak jacket protects Tweeden from actually being groped. Moore is a dirty old perv who chased after teenage skirts but I have not seen that he has been accused of forcing himself on a female (of any age) and groping them. Although apparently if he groped a lady while she was wearing a thick jacket that would be okay since he was not really groping her breasts, right Rock?

That you don't comprehend Rock's remarks and understand why the photo is different than the "groping" committed by the likes of Weinstein, et al is on you. And, again, nobody is saying what Franken did was appropriate.

My thought has always been that many (most) of the positions taken by liberals come with an out clause as long as the perpetrator plays for the right team. Rape away Bill. Whip your dick out Harvey and force women to play with it. Slut shame and shout down accusers of Bubba, Gloria. It is all good because you play for the right team.

Hypocrites.

See above. Who are you talking about here? Weinstein and Spacey are liberals. They and Ailes acted in comparable ways and it had nothing to do with their party affiliation. We've said as much here. You ignore that and slur posters on the board without basis.

 

[IUCrazy2]

You are incorrect about what Moore has been accused of.

I will cop to that. I know he was perving after teenagers and had written him off at that point. If there is more, then he is even more of a pervy turd than I was aware of.

 

[iuwclurker1]

That said, and I guess I'm a douche for even saying this, but do a Google Image search on her. Then tell me if you don't think her outrage and disgust isn't a bit overblown.

PUre and utter bullshit. Say this to your wife's face. Or your daughter's. If you daughter wears a mini-skirt, does she deserve sexual harassment? Tell me all about it.

Franken needs to come clean. For himself. For his career. But most of all for women.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Sounds to me, from her own account, that he made a clumsy but aggressive pass at her, she rejected him, and that is it. He should certainly apologize for the photo, but even her version doesn't sound like sexual misconduct. We really need to not conflate all these things into the same category, for fear of lessening the impact of what some people did. What Weinstein is accused of is different than what Louis CK is accused of, and both are different than what Franken is accused of.

 

[iuwclurker1]

Wut?

That strikes me as some over the top false equivalency unless there's a lot more about Franken out there that's not in the story. That doesn't mean Franken's reported forced kiss or inappropriate picture are okay, but that's pretty far removed from the essence of the profoundly problematic issues surrounding guys like Weinstein, Cosby, Spacey, Moore, Halperin, etc. and the culture that tolerates it. Franken may even be a link in the same chain for all I know, but saying it's factually exactly all the same thing (or worse?) tends to nullify the problem, I think.

I called him a chickenshit for a reason. I never drew any equivalence between the types of sexual harassment. You falsely attributed that to me. I clearly attacked Franken for not admitting his wrongdoing and sloughing it off, unlike Louis CK, who set a notable precedent for supporting and empowering women further by admitting his wrongdoing in full.

Franken should come clean for women. We're a forgiving nation. We can forgive him too. But he needs to admit what he did and that it's wrong. Only then does he warrant any forgiveness.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Hypocrisy abounds when it comes to politics, IUCrazy.

That was my point a while back about Bill Clinton -- and finally that got to the point where Goat (I think it was Goat, he can correct me if I'm wrong) could only say that he didn't believe one or more of Clinton's accusers.

Democrats didn't defend WJC, vote for him twice, etc. etc. because they didn't believe the accusations. They may have cited that as the reason -- in fact, they might have even convinced themselves of it. But I'd argue that they did so because, for them, he was simply better than the alternative.

So, when people ask me how I could possibly vote for a douchebag like Donald Trump, I'm just stripping away all the pretense. It's not because I think he's actually better than he presents himself or any other contrived reason. I voted for him because I suspect his election would bring more of the types of policies I want and fewer of the types of policies I don't want.

Some may scoff at that. But at least I'm honest about it.

I was in that conversation with you, but you are inaccurately describing what I said. No surprise, of course. You have a habit of rephrasing liberals in your own mind so they all sound like the hypocritical leftist cartoon characters you imagine us to be.