“Everyone knows something wrong is happening in Liberal America”

JamieDimonsBalls

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If you don’t remember, Ms Weiss was previously the editor for the Opinion section of The NY Times, before resigning because of unwillingness of the paper to allow fair balance.


I get calls from parents telling me about the damaging things being taught in schools: so-called antiracist programs that urge children to obsess on the color of their skin.

I get calls from people working in corporate America forced to go to trainings in which they learn that they carry collective, race-based guilt — or benefit from collective, race-based virtue.

I get calls from young people just launching their careers telling me that they feel they have no choice but to profess fealty to this ideology in order to keep their jobs.


Reminds us of what Morgan Freeman was saying... obsessing about race only makes this worse.

 
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T.M.P.

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lol ............

ends with a guy talking about being obsessed with race. The irony is thick.
 
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iuwclurker

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If you don’t remember, Ms Weiss was previously the editor for the Opinion section of The NY Times, before resigning because of unwillingness of the paper to allow fair balance.



I get calls from parents telling me about the damaging things being taught in schools: so-called antiracist programs that urge children to obsess on the color of their skin.

I get calls from people working in corporate America forced to go to trainings in which they learn that they carry collective, race-based guilt — or benefit from collective, race-based virtue.

I get calls from young people just launching their careers telling me that they feel they have no choice but to profess fealty to this ideology in order to keep their jobs.

Reminds us of what Morgan Freeman was saying... obsessing about race only makes this worse.

All people are human beings. That is the lowest common denominator.

Many of these controversial issues have to do with the body, not the human being. Laws should be about human beings, policy should be about human beings, movements should be toward treating people as fellow human beings.
 
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T.M.P.

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All people are human beings. That is the lowest common denominator.

Many of these controversial issues have to do with the body, not the human being. Laws should be about human beings, policy should be about human beings, movements should be toward treating people as fellow human beings.
You forget that old white guy narrative is there is no racism or that it's far less than what the "media" makes it out to be. These kind of threads are meant to convince everyone that old white guys aren't really racist because racism doesn't really exist and "those" other people get everything handed to them for free and laws are made to treat them better, while old white guys get nothing for free and don't have laws written to treat them better.. that's the real racism occuring. The liberal progressive oppression of old white guys.
 
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Hoopsdoc1978

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You forget that old white guy narrative is there is no racism or that it's far less than what the "media" makes it out to be. These kind of threads are meant to convince everyone that old white guys aren't really racist because racism doesn't really exist and "those" other people get everything handed to them for free and laws are made to treat them better, while old white guys get nothing for free and don't have laws written to treat them better.. that's the real racism occuring. The liberal progressive oppression of old white guys.
This response to that article is hilariously ironic.

It’s to bad you’re to dumb to appreciate it.
 

HooDatGuy

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This response to that article is hilariously ironic.

It’s to bad you’re to dumb to appreciate it.

Going on a tirade about racist old white men, based off an article about a middle aged woman, written by a Jewish lesbian.

The guy has issues.
 
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TheOriginalHappyGoat

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Going on a tirade about racist old white men, based off an article about a middle aged woman, written by a Jewish lesbian.

The guy has issues.
Whatever you feel about TMP's style, he's right about one thing: OP doesn't really understand the article. It's unlikely any of you do. If you're tripping over yourself to explain how this describes the very same problems with liberalism that you've been shouting from the rooftops, you're wrong. If the article reminds you of that one particular Morgan Freeman clip that is responsible for more conservative white erections than PornHub, you don't get it.

Weiss has been attacking what she views as a very real problem in liberalism, but the problem isn't what you guys think it is, because liberalism isn't what you think it is. So long as you imagine liberalism as a caricature, its self-critiques will always - incorrectly - sound like an echo of your own opinions in your head.
 

jet812

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Whatever you feel about TMP's style, he's right about one thing: OP doesn't really understand the article. It's unlikely any of you do. If you're tripping over yourself to explain how this describes the very same problems with liberalism that you've been shouting from the rooftops, you're wrong. If the article reminds you of that one particular Morgan Freeman clip that is responsible for more conservative white erections than PornHub, you don't get it.

Weiss has been attacking what she views as a very real problem in liberalism, but the problem isn't what you guys think it is, because liberalism isn't what you think it is. So long as you imagine liberalism as a caricature, its self-critiques will always - incorrectly - sound like an echo of your own opinions in your head.
That’s a lot of words to say nothing...
 

HooDatGuy

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Whatever you feel about TMP's style, he's right about one thing: OP doesn't really understand the article. It's unlikely any of you do. If you're tripping over yourself to explain how this describes the very same problems with liberalism that you've been shouting from the rooftops, you're wrong. If the article reminds you of that one particular Morgan Freeman clip that is responsible for more conservative white erections than PornHub, you don't get it.

Weiss has been attacking what she views as a very real problem in liberalism, but the problem isn't what you guys think it is, because liberalism isn't what you think it is. So long as you imagine liberalism as a caricature, its self-critiques will always - incorrectly - sound like an echo of your own opinions in your head.

There is nothing liberal about what the student and administration at Smith did. The cancel culture, wokesters are actually the antithesis of liberal, but they are generally Democrats.
 
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Hoopsdoc1978

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Weiss might say the exact same thing, but she'd mean something very different by it than you would.
I’m curious what you mean by “she means something different”.

I think she’s saying exactly what HDG says she is.

She may have different reasons for saying it but but I think he was correct in his interpretation of what she said.
 
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TheOriginalHappyGoat

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Whatever.
Please don't take offense. I'm not calling you stupid, or anything. It's just that members of a group criticizing what they consider excesses within the group will usually mean something entirely different than outsiders doing the same, especially when the outsiders are adversaries. Weiss and you have very different conceptions of the liberal community, so your critiques are also going to be very different, even if you feel there is some surface connection between them.

It's just the way of things.
 

TheOriginalHappyGoat

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I’m curious what you mean by “she means something different”.

I think she’s saying exactly what HDG says she is.

She may have different reasons for saying it but but I think he was correct in his interpretation of what she said.
I think the Morgan Freeman clip makes my point. You conservatives love that clip. "Just stop talking about race, and it will go away!" That's what you think it means. And maybe that's what Freeman actually meant. But it's not at all what Weiss means. Not even close.
 

Hoopsdoc1978

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I think the Morgan Freeman clip makes my point. You conservatives love that clip. "Just stop talking about race, and it will go away!" That's what you think it means. And maybe that's what Freeman actually meant. But it's not at all what Weiss means. Not even close.
I mean, I’ve never seen the Freeman clip, but if that’s the gist of what he said, then obviously that’s not what she was talking about. She said the exact opposite. That race is the critical factor in every decision Smith makes. Which is why she quit.

I don’t think that’s some deep revelation on your part. Or that it’s any better. It’s probably worse, actually.
 
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TheOriginalHappyGoat

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That race is the critical factor in every decision Smith makes. Which is why she quit.
Well, that's Shaw, not Weiss. I guess you are confusing the two? But it's still not what either of them actually said.

Again, as I said to Farva, this isn't an insult. I don't think you're stupid because you don't understand. I have a hard time understanding a lot of what's in your head, too. We have different paradigms. That makes it tough to really grasp how the other one is thinking. You guys are jumping on a liberal attacking other liberals and imagining that you don't have that handicap. Spoiler alert: you do.
 

iuwclurker

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I’m curious what you mean by “she means something different”.

I think she’s saying exactly what HDG says she is.

She may have different reasons for saying it but but I think he was correct in his interpretation of what she said.
Simply put:

Liberals: There’s a systemic racism problem. (Weiss: Okay, but this isn’t the solution.)

You conservatives: There isn’t a systemic racism problem.
 

JamieDimonsBalls

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I think the Morgan Freeman clip makes my point. You conservatives love that clip. "Just stop talking about race, and it will go away!" That's what you think it means. And maybe that's what Freeman actually meant. But it's not at all what Weiss means. Not even close.

It ties into this directly...

“What is happening is wrong. Any ideology that asks people to judge others based on their skin color is wrong. Any ideology that asks us to reduce ourselves and others to racial stereotypes is wrong. Any ideology that treats dissent as evidence of bigotry is wrong. Any ideology that denies our common humanity is wrong. You should say so”

I can’t imagine someone that has labeled dissenters as racist would ever agree with or understand their points.

if only society could stop obsessing over race, but it will get worse before it gets better
 
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INRanger27

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Please don't take offense. I'm not calling you stupid, or anything. It's just that members of a group criticizing what they consider excesses within the group will usually mean something entirely different than outsiders doing the same, especially when the outsiders are adversaries. Weiss and you have very different conceptions of the liberal community, so your critiques are also going to be very different, even if you feel there is some surface connection between them.

It's just the way of things.
I don’t follow. If you’re saying that race baiting Woke ideology is not synonymous with liberalism - then I agree but that’s oversimplifying isn’t it? Trumpsters are not synonymous with conservatism but that doesn’t stop most people on here from confusing the two.

All wokes are liberals - period. I agree it is not liberal behavior but they’re all liberals...at least that’s how they vote.
 

hoot1

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I don’t follow. If you’re saying that race baiting Woke ideology is not synonymous with liberalism - then I agree but that’s oversimplifying isn’t it? Trumpsters are not synonymous with conservatism but that doesn’t stop most people on here from confusing the two.

All wokes are liberals - period. I agree it is not liberal behavior but they’re all liberals...at least that’s how they vote.


Ranger, here is an article suggesting ...

The New Front in the Culture Wars: Wokes vs. Liberals
 

i'vegotwinners

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If you don’t remember, Ms Weiss was previously the editor for the Opinion section of The NY Times, before resigning because of unwillingness of the paper to allow fair balance.



I get calls from parents telling me about the damaging things being taught in schools: so-called antiracist programs that urge children to obsess on the color of their skin.

I get calls from people working in corporate America forced to go to trainings in which they learn that they carry collective, race-based guilt — or benefit from collective, race-based virtue.

I get calls from young people just launching their careers telling me that they feel they have no choice but to profess fealty to this ideology in order to keep their jobs.


Reminds us of what Morgan Freeman was saying... obsessing about race only makes this worse.



schools from K-doctorate have always "indoctrinated" students, and as much to the right as to the left.

virtually all media has always had a strong propaganda element, and as much to the right as to the left, except when it comes to economic issues.

on economic issues, all mainstream media is somewhere between far right, and fall off the edge of the earth far right.

and yes, left leaning media goes crazyville left some on social issues.

it's how they keep the libs distracted from how far right they are on everything economic.
 

TheOriginalHappyGoat

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I don’t follow. If you’re saying that race baiting Woke ideology is not synonymous with liberalism - then I agree but that’s oversimplifying isn’t it? Trumpsters are not synonymous with conservatism but that doesn’t stop most people on here from confusing the two.

All wokes are liberals - period. I agree it is not liberal behavior but they’re all liberals...at least that’s how they vote.
Huh? No, I'm not saying anything remotely like that. I'm saying that, based on OP and a lot of responses, the general interpretation of Weiss by the conservatives in this thread seems to be something along the lines of, "She agrees with us that people need to just stop talking about race, and racism will go away, and the problem with liberals is that they are obsessed with talking about race." That's not remotely at all what she's saying, but it's the only interpretation that fits with the cartoonish understanding of liberals that most conservatives on this forum have.
 
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INRanger27

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Huh? No, I'm not saying anything remotely like that. I'm saying that, based on OP and a lot of responses, the general interpretation of Weiss by the conservatives in this thread seems to be something along the lines of, "She agrees with us that people need to just stop talking about race, and racism will go away, and the problem with liberals is that they are obsessed with talking about race." That's not remotely at all what she's saying, but it's the only interpretation that fits with the cartoonish understanding of liberals that most conservatives on this forum have.
Oh I would doubt (perhaps hopefully) that is what conservatives are saying.
 

TheOriginalHappyGoat

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Oh I would doubt (perhaps hopefully) that is what conservatives are saying.
I am more pessimistic than you. Besides the fact that numerous conservatives have said that before, it fits the general tenor of the discussion. Plus, again, Morgan Freeman! That clip has been posted here probably about forty bajillion times, and it's always to make the point that we just need to stop talking about it, gosh darn it!

But let me stop being such a crank and actually try to add to the conversation:

Weiss actually has several problems with modern liberals (particularly, I think, the so-called "woke" white liberals, although I'm sure not exclusively), but the one she's highlighting here is the idea that some segments of the liberal community have settled on a preferred narrative for racial deconstruction that requires individuals (especially whites) to go through a very particular and rigid thought process determined by their own racial identity. In other words, in the name of racial justice, whites are expected to critically examine their own whiteness in a specific manner, and are increasingly judged by how willing they are to fall in line with this expectation. At least, that's my understanding.

I do think that Weiss has a point, and whether she accurately pinpoints the problem, and how widespread it actually is, are both worth talking about. I don't think most of the posters in this thread are remotely close to even grasping the subject, much less discussing it.

(Despite his rather brief offering, I think @IUJIM of all folks came pretty close.)
 

IUJIM

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I am more pessimistic than you. Besides the fact that numerous conservatives have said that before, it fits the general tenor of the discussion. Plus, again, Morgan Freeman! That clip has been posted here probably about forty bajillion times, and it's always to make the point that we just need to stop talking about it, gosh darn it!

But let me stop being such a crank and actually try to add to the conversation:

Weiss actually has several problems with modern liberals (particularly, I think, the so-called "woke" white liberals, although I'm sure not exclusively), but the one she's highlighting here is the idea that some segments of the liberal community have settled on a preferred narrative for racial deconstruction that requires individuals (especially whites) to go through a very particular and rigid thought process determined by their own racial identity. In other words, in the name of racial justice, whites are expected to critically examine their own whiteness in a specific manner, and are increasingly judged by how willing they are to fall in line with this expectation. At least, that's my understanding.

I do think that Weiss has a point, and whether she accurately pinpoints the problem, and how widespread it actually is, are both worth talking about. I don't think most of the posters in this thread are remotely close to even grasping the subject, much less discussing it.

(Despite his rather brief offering, I think @IUJIM of all folks came pretty close.)
"of all folks"? Not sure what to make of that little tidbit.
 
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Indianaftw

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So, you post a link to "The Epoch Times" when bemoaning the lack of journalism? :oops:
Ohhh so sorry its not msm. They won't report what the Epoch Times just did because its not in the "narrative". You wanna tell me why the idiot left is still out protesting in Portland?
 

iuwclurker

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Me....conservative..systematic racism does exist

Progressive Liberals....We can fix systematic racism by being systematically racists against whites.
I put “ You conservatives” deliberately to exclude conservatives like you!
 

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