Found it interesting.
http://athlonsports.com/college-football/ranking-big-tens-college-football-coaches-2015
http://athlonsports.com/college-football/ranking-big-tens-college-football-coaches-2015
Ranking the B10 Coaches from Athlon
- Thread starter Harrell
- Start date
The list is pretty good. I agree that Dantonio should be 2nd but that is splitting hairs. The list seems right.
I think highly of harbaugh, but feel as though he has undeservedly achieved some mythical god like status.
He took one of the worst programs in the country and turned them into a national powerhouse, and did it without having any previous D1 head coaching experience. That would like some hotshot coordinator taking over at IU or Purdue and making a couple of playoff appearances. He then went to the NFL and made 3 consecutive conference championship games (with one Super Bowl appearance thrown in for good measure). Do you have any idea how rare it is to have elite coaching success at both the college and pro levels?
The guy is, without question, one of the best coaches of the current generation.
I think Kill is too low. Take out the first year and he is averaging just under 8 wins a year at a program that doesn't get high profile recruits. Compound this with the health scares and the guy is killing it...pun intended.
He's more likely to get fired/run out of town. The natives are not happy and he has one of the weakest rosters in the conference.
I agree. . . He still has not proven anything in the Big 10 and he is being rated on his "potential".
Eh, I still rate Fitzgerald higher than Kill. Kill is a really good coach, but I'd argue that the sustained success at a program like Northwestern is significantly more challenging than what Kill's done at Minnesota - a much easier place to win.
I also have zero clue what Franklin's doing at #4. It's got to be the SEC experience.
I don't rate Mike Riley as highly as they do.
Even still... His record at Vandy is a bit deceiving. While having pretty solid overall records there, he only had something like 4 total wins over teams with winning records in his 3 years. I think he's a solid coach, but I think there are definitely some in front of him.
For me
1. Meyer
2. Dantonio
3. Harbaugh
4. Fitz
5. Kill
6. Franklin
PSU is #6 in the COUNTRY in recruiting. That includes the SEC. Only SEC schools ahead of PSU are Bama and LSU. Only B10 school ahead of PSU is OSU. PSU is now ahead of MSU and UM in recruiting and that is with 5 less commits.
Recruiting can change in a hurry. I'm sure it's a great class, but until he starts winning, I don't know that I can rank him higher than guys that have done more with less already.
MOST winning teams get most of their wins vs losing teams. The reason the teams with losing records have losing records is because you beat them. If VAndy had lost to all those teams then some of those teams they played would have had winning records.
Franklin took a team that never won and he won. He then took a team that was decimated with sanctions and went 7-6. The sanctions will not be totally over for a couple more years. PSU got the scholarships back but most of the incoming freshman never saw the field. So far Franklin's 50 recruits only about 7 have seen the field. PSU went into last spring with 5 healthy scholarship OL and one EE. That was it. PSU went the whole year without a scholarship punter.
You will see a different PSU team in a couple years when they have 10+ 4 star OL with experience vs this years team with 2 stars, freshman and two converted DTs on the OL.
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. PSU finished #14 in 2015 and will be top #15 this year with a shot at top #10. Notice how PSU is up there with Alabama, OSU, UM and MSU? How do those classes look compared to IU's #70?
Who did more with LESS? Who had less than 5 scholarship OL in camp last spring? How about NOBODY. Who played the season without a scholarship punter? Who had a walk on QB as backup?
The team Franklin inherited was still under sanctions and filled with walk-ons.
Who did more with less in the SEC? Did Alabama have LESS talent than Vandy?
The point that I was trying to make was that he gets a lot of "credit" for winning the in the "SEC", but this doesn't acknowledge that his stint in the SEC East corresponded to major historic down periods to both Tenn and Fla (and Vandy got lucky with a crossover with Auburn during their flop year). Basically, his best team at Vandy likely would have finished with 6-7 wins if the SEC was at typical strength (still decent for a school like Vandy).
No one is arguing that Franklin is bad coach, just not 4th best in the conference
Can't we say the same about Urban and Dantonio? Wasn't the B10 down the last few years?
Sanctions or not, anybody that thinks that recruiting at PSU is a tough gig is smoking some nice crack cocaine.
PSU is pretty much entrenched in the Northeast. Kids from Pennsylvania dream of playing there. Joe Pa was pretty much allowed to do what he wanted even when the man was becoming senile.
It ain't a tough gig but Franklin will eventually get a lot of pressure to beat OSU, Michigan and MSU. How he finishes in the East division will determine the fan love fest with Franklin.
PSU is pretty much entrenched in the Northeast. Kids from Pennsylvania dream of playing there. Joe Pa was pretty much allowed to do what he wanted even when the man was becoming senile.
It ain't a tough gig but Franklin will eventually get a lot of pressure to beat OSU, Michigan and MSU. How he finishes in the East division will determine the fan love fest with Franklin.
Zwick - you are all over the place on this one.
IU was not #70 in recruiting any of the last 2 years.
Hard to be taken seriously when you say that "the Big Ten was down" last year. It not only produced the national champion but also had its usual teams in Wisconsin and MSU.
IU was not #70 in recruiting any of the last 2 years.
Hard to be taken seriously when you say that "the Big Ten was down" last year. It not only produced the national champion but also had its usual teams in Wisconsin and MSU.
I am consistent. Different recruiting services have different rankings. IU was #51 last year and was #70 on 247 when I posted.
Where do YOU rank IU's recruiting class?
Well, it was not Penn State. You act as if the entire team was made of scrubs and walk-ons. The starters were a cast of players that all had offers and at least your QB stayed healthy and you didn't have to rely on a skinny frosh with no big offers and no game experience.
YOu had them at 50th for 2015 and I had 51. I am not exactly all over the place as you described. I listed them at 70 for 2016 based on 247. You did not list this years class.
PSU lost about 20 4 star+ recruits . THAt includes about 3-5 5 stars. You act like they replaced all the 4 stars with other 4 stars but the reality is they replaced them with 2s and 3s. Some of those players did not have ANY offers. They also had 20 less scholarship players who were replaced with walkons.
The media and the experts said the sanctions were the death penalty. Now you act like it was nothing.
Who did MORE with LESS?
Zwick - step back from the ledge and get your head out of Jerry Sandusky' ass. I know, I know....he probably likes that.
The bottom line is that the sanctions did little to Penn State as all knew they would. Even with sanctions in place, the scholarship reduction still drew in 6 four star kids in 2014. This was before the lift of the sanctions. You had an elite rated QB committing 1 year after the probation. Your defense had veteran highly ranked players all over the place. The offensive line took a hit but that was perhaps the one area of weakness. That was evident in 2013 when IU laid the wood to them. When PSU had trouble
moving the ball that year against one of the all-time worst IU defenses, everybody knew that Penn State was "down."
But, please, spare the preaching about doing "more with less." You cannot fathom what "less" means until you talk to veteran IU fans who witnessed years, decades, of less.
Respectfully, the above point was about "doing more with less" - not having less.
I still think Franklin is a bit unproven. He did a nice job winning with someone else's recruits at Vandy, but his own recruits have been a remarkable flop since he left. I'm curious how his recruiting classes pan out at PSU.
Yes, PSU's OL was horrible last year.
That's fine. This is all pretty subjective.
"Less" than....what? Less than normal PSU talent? Other Big Ten schools?
Doing "more" than he was supposed to? Given the talent level he had on defense, which really defines a team's success, I'll stick with saying he did about what was suspected at the program.
"Less" than....what? Less than normal PSU talent? Other Big Ten schools?
Doing "more" than he was supposed to? Given the talent level he had on defense, which really defines a team's success, I'll stick with saying he did about what was suspected at the program.
Please name the 20 four star recruits they lost.
You must drink the kool aid at PSU and still think Joe Pa did everything he should of.
Who did more with less? Quick rundown of starters or starters who had more than a few starts:
PSU
1-5 star
9-4 stars
11-3 stars (many 5.7 which is a tenth below 4 star status)
2-2 stars
IU
3-4 stars
15-3 stars (many who were 5.5 which is a step above a 2 star, some 5.7)
3-2 stars
4-not ranked with stars
After the Joe Pa turning a blind eye tragedy, they lost depth but had plenty of talent.
Jerron Jones
Will Fuller (17 TDs this year)
Tommy Shutt
Joey Oconner
Armani Reeves
Cameron Williams
Greg Webb
Ross Douglas
Zach Bradshaw
Dorion Johnson
JP Holtz
JJ Denman
Jamil Pollard
Shawn Oakman
Paul Jones
Khari Fortte'
Silas REdd
Rob Bolden
Justin Brown.
Those were just the decommits and transfers. OSU picked up the most players in the deal.
There is then a long list of local players who were all PSU but they ended up losing like Noah Spence, Thomas Holley, David Williams and so on.
The ten lost scholarships would have been a mix of 3s and 4s.
When are you going to name who did more with less?
Joe has been gone for 4 years now. These are not his players. Many of them are also freshman. YOu will see the real Franklin in a couple years when the team is stacked.
I did not bring up doing more with less. THat was one of YOUR posters.
Show me where any fan thought PSU was going to cruise through the sanctions. The reality is most experts said it was the death penalty.
Where is all the talent on the defense? Do you mean the walk on free safety Ryan Keiser? True freshman starting safety Marcus Allen? 2 star WR(flipped after PSUs 4 stars flipped to OSU and UM) that was converted to starting CB. 2 star starting DT(Johnson)
The reality is PSU did more with less. They lost 20+ 4 star players who they then replaced with 2s and 3s. PSU then played 3 seasons without a losing record even though the experts said they would have trouble fielding a team.
It will be another year before pSU even has a punter and kicker on scholarship.
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